Mythbusting the Human Rights Act
In preparation for the all-but-inevitable Tory attack on the HRA later today, here's some valuable prophylaxis.
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Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 10:44,
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Yeah, but
this Romanian bloke around my way, right, he killed five kids but they had to let him stay in his council house because his wife can't support the kids on his own and he's got three gay kids and a dog with diabetes.
(, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 10:54, Share, Reply)
Naaaaah.
He wasn't Romanian. He was Muslamic. And they give him £20,000 every week because his neighbour had roast pork and that's racist.
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Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 10:57,
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Know him?
The law says I have to go and mow his lawns every weekend, because feminism.
And the gays, obviously.
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Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 11:01,
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look, I'm not saying Hitler was right but...
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HappyToast Groat froth, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 11:06,
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I got told that he recived £35,000 because all his neighbours kept having showers and baths and he dudnt
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fluffybunnykiller Is feasting on the clitoris of life, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 11:42,
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I heard from someone that they all get bought ferraris cos the council can't afford their free taxis
(, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 13:37, Share, Reply)
Dear Mr Enzyme, what can we the people actually do about this?
The way I see it we're fucked, we're being fucked from on high and no one seems able to stop them, or cares enough to try as long as shitly dancing and XFactor are on tv.
Protests lead nowhere (except for the people that go for a fight or a new TV), online petitions are useless, anyone with the slightest power to change things is already corrupt or too flawed a human being to avoid a well placed media assassination.
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HappyToast Groat froth, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 11:05,
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I wish I knew.
It's also worth noting that the UK government wins the overwhelming majority of cases brought before the ECtHR - far more, I believe, than other governments. And yet the press persists in painting the HRA, ECHR, and ECtHR as being a foreign plot against John Bull, because that's a better story than the alternative, and so sells more.
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Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 11:11,
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dammit man! what's the use in being intelligent and stuff if you can't just fix things
*votes UKIP*
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HappyToast Groat froth, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 11:14,
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I say start a new B3ta political oarty and in the manifesto give every one massivd drugs and Honda accords plus we can have goatsee as the back drop to all conferances just so that every one knows there have been shat on by the others
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fluffybunnykiller Is feasting on the clitoris of life, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 11:46,
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I'd consider voting for FBK,
if I could work out what the hell he was on about.
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Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 11:51,
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massive drugs and Honda accords for everyone
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fluffybunnykiller Is feasting on the clitoris of life, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 11:55,
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That's more than all the other parties are offering.
What sort of 'party' doesn't have massive drugs? Amirite?
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Fray Brentos *mega-belms*, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 11:56,
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ann summers partys dont have mazsive drugs. just massive wobbly rubber cocks
So I am ttold
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fluffybunnykiller Is feasting on the clitoris of life, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 12:01,
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Start a twitter campaign
If you get a few hundred followers, you can do anything!
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CanonCaliber A big bore, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 11:24,
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Jack of Kent,
whence this link comes, has thousands. The problem is that the people who're most likely even to read things like this are not those who really need persuading; and those who need persuading are likely to resist persuasion simply because they'll be suspicious of the person making the case simply by dint of his making it.
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Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 11:26,
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and those of us who read these things read them, get wound up
then remember we need to get back to work or we're not going to get paid.
Keep people down just enough to not fight back. Go team!
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HappyToast Groat froth, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 11:29,
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I don't think it's anything as deliberate as your final line indicates.
I suspect that it's just the way the world turns, like a political version of the laws of thermodynamics.
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Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 11:31,
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Apparantly, nobody cares
epetitions.direct.gov.uk/search?q=european%2Bhuman%2Brights%2Bact&state=open
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CanonCaliber A big bore, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 11:40,
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Yeah, but that's a really strange search,
given that there's no such thing as the European Human Rights Act.
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Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 11:41,
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Good read
I wish people would read more about the issues involved.
(, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 11:35, Share, Reply)
in broad agreement with the whole act
but unsure what I think about freedom of religion being a protected human right. Shouldnt the state be trying to discourage this sort of harmful, divisive behavior rather than sanctioning it
(, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 11:42, Share, Reply)
What do you find objectionable?
Freedom of thought, conscience and religion
1 Everyone has the right to freedom of thought, conscience and religion; this right includes freedom to change his religion or belief and freedom, either alone or in community with others and in public or private, to manifest his religion or belief, in worship, teaching, practice and observance.
2 Freedom to manifest one’s religion or beliefs shall be subject only to such limitations as are prescribed by law and are necessary in a democratic society in the interests of public safety, for the protection of public order, health or morals, or for the protection of the rights and freedoms of others.
Genuinely struggling to see the problem. Isn't a secular state - one that takes no position at all on matters like this - massively more desirable than the alternative?
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Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 11:50,
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I would suggest freedom of thought and freedom of religion are incompatible
But dont get me wrong, I wouldnt put my shiny black jackboot down on superstition immediately. First I'd try separating church and state, removing any religious element from education and promoting critical thinking in schools. Basically the equivalent of putting the fag packets out of sight behind the counter. If there were any left after, say, 50 years, I'd treat it as a mental health issue.
But what I wouldnt do is enshrine in law the right to believe in the supernatural
(, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 12:16, Share, Reply)
But it's hard to see how denying someone the right to believe stupid stuff would be desirable, or enforceable.
Undesirable, because you have to admit your own fallibility. Even if your argument is strong, humans have been known to make mistakes.
Unenforceable, because... well, because.
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Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 13:45,
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Its problematic because there used to be a clear line between medical science and alternative therapies
but, now medical science has been found to be heavily skewed by pharmaceutical companies
And there's the whole issue of what a rational belief is, and how to put that in law. Are they beliefs based on a rational method, or are they beliefs that are held by the majority (both of these definitions of rationality are used in cases of medical negligence).
(, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 13:57, Share, Reply)
I think there's a big difference between tolerating stupidity and enshrining that tolerance in law
A civil society should be able to tolerate stupidity but should also strive towards reducing it. A law protecting it as a human right is neither helpful or desirable.
(, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 13:58, Share, Reply)
I think that's enshrined in laws guaranteeing access to education
(, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 14:01, Share, Reply)
access to education is guaranteed as a human right in this act
but so is the right of parents to be able to expect an education for their children that conforms with their religious convictions, regardless of how wrongheaded those convictions might be.
That's the most worrying bit.
(, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 14:18, Share, Reply)
the right of parents to expect education for their children to conform with their religious convictions
is breaking the right of those children to the freedom of thought
no single right is absolute, but is limited and complimented by other rights
(, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 14:22, Share, Reply)
The act limits the freedom of 'religion' (the institution) in the freedom of thought, conscience and religion (religious belief)
Its important, when muslim, sikh, and hindu adults in Britain are being disowned and mistreated by their parents and family because they convert to another religion or choose atheism.
And what's wrong with irrational belief, as long as it doesn't hurt anyone else? We'd end up attacking any beliefs based on metaphysical postulates.
Isn't it irrational that there are many people who believe in scientific facts because 'they were told it at school' or that 'scientists believe it, therefore I believe it'?
(, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 13:50, Share, Reply)
^ this
And anybody telling you they intellectually 'chose' their religion or atheism is a liar. People believe what they happen to believe.
Low intelligence might make someone more likely to just believe what their parents believe but anyone who thinks that religious=stupid and atheist=clever is an idiot, which would be obvious enough if they ever tried to debate some like Rowan Williams or Mohammed Ansar for example.
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Afinkawan Yes I can hear you Clem Fandango, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 17:26,
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stupid/clever isnt a particularly useful way of looking at it
indoctrinated/enlightened might be better. There's hope for even the most credulous. That's the real Good News
(, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 20:39, Share, Reply)
So 'freedom of thought'
Only if they think things you agree with?
That's exactly why human rights laws are needed.
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Afinkawan Yes I can hear you Clem Fandango, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 17:10,
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as I said, I wouldnt get the jackboots out immediately
But if you think, for example, that contraception is evil because a group of celibate men in Rome tell you to, how is that 'freedom of thought'. That, in my eyes, is the polar opposite
(, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 20:48, Share, Reply)
Tinfoil anti-tory hats to the ready!
This is a feeble article which picks on a couple of out of context examples of minor Tories putting across their own opinions, rather than those of the party.
Anyone could pick a string of lies peddled by members of any of the other political parties, but Jack of Kent won't do that because he is a left-wing fanatic, bordering on swivel eyed maniac.
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DinivanX Has stinging piss after drinking Pact Coffee, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 11:56,
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Oh I agree with you
I just can't take articles seriously from anyone who doesn't try and balance it and say "look all of these politician gunts are just as shitty, hypocritical and ill-informed as the fcuks that vote for them"
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DinivanX Has stinging piss after drinking Pact Coffee, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 12:03,
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whilst ghis can of worms is open
Every one has see mint imperials but what about the dark brown mint colonials never see them or any one standing up fof ghem
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fluffybunnykiller Is feasting on the clitoris of life, Tue 30 Sep 2014, 12:08,
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