I didn't say it was a basic right.
I said it was a basic good. And, like health, I don't see why there should be a quota or time-limit.

I'll also go to my grave arguing against the pernicious belief that a university education is about getting a job.
( Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Fri 15 Oct 2010, 13:56, 1 reply)

Yep, and I'll agree with you all the way on that
But you also can't have every single person walking that path when they fundamentally don't want to, do you?

All those people who are being forced to should have the choice to pursue a different, as fulfilling, path.
(MrOli is ugly, but in the morning you will be sober, Fri 15 Oct 2010, 14:08, closed)

I do believe that you're arguing against a position that no sane person holds...
Of course people who don't want a degree shouldn't have to - just as those who don't want medical treatment shouldn't have to accept it. I'm not quite sure what you're driving at.
( Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Fri 15 Oct 2010, 14:10, closed)

I'm advocating a system which is more exclusive
attracting and accepting only the best at a smaller rate, and which is therefore affordable for the country and free for the people who have the academic means to be accepted.

The people who are not suited to pure academia should be at technical colleges, art colleges, apprenticeships or go straight from a-levels in to work. And, up to a certain point, these things should not incur cost either.

The current system treats university as an extension to school, and as such, requires huge resources and does those who go through it few favours.

And I'm going even further to say that if it means that 90% of people go, 90% of 21 year olds will owe the government £20-30k, which is great for government control of the populous but a pretty lousy start for the 21 year olds.

Don't have to? You tell a kid who knows they wont get a job if they join the 10% who aren't going to uni that uni is not something they *have* to do...
(MrOli is ugly, but in the morning you will be sober, Fri 15 Oct 2010, 14:25, closed)

(This actually wouldn't be too dissimilar to how the world worked about 20 years ago... ;-) )

(MrOli is ugly, but in the morning you will be sober, Fri 15 Oct 2010, 14:31, closed)

^ this
is pretty much exactly how I feel about it.

Yes, everyone should be entitled to a good education, but that education need not necessarily take the form of academic study, and in fact I'd contend that the majority of the population are not suited to that form of education. As MrOli says, there are technical colleges, apprenticeships and on the job training too. Each of these is as valuable as an academic study course, for someone who is suited to that particular form of education.

It's not often that I disagree with Enzyme, but I do this time. On parts of his argument, at least.
( K2k6 has a proper job these days, Mon 18 Oct 2010, 13:22, closed)