I am sick and tired of the "Stop Violence against women campaign"
Particularly in western society, it is outright discrimination. Stopping violence against everyone is a good thing, but why just women? When you read their propaganda, violence includes controlling
-spending.
-who their friends are
-what they wear.
also denigration.

I have yet to meet a woman who themselves does not use these measures in a relationship. Does that mean that males must accept what women consider abuse? Why?
In our so called advanced society, why am I not afforded the same rights as the vagina owners club?
(M61A1 CUPID- STUNTS, Thu 31 Dec 2009, 4:48, 14 replies)

I get none of those from her...
...so long as I obey her meekly, of course :o)

But seriously, no real issues, by and large. What I will agree with in your post is that the "stop violence against women" is very wrong-headed. It carries the implicit suggestion that violence against men is somehow more acceptable.

It ain't. I think in most cases it would be better if the campaign was "stop domestic violence" but perhaps that doesn't score as highly on the emotional factor that many campaigns like to play on these days.
(clopinettes, Thu 31 Dec 2009, 10:49, closed)

"the vagina owners club"
teehee
( --=| Daz |=-- has been masturbating over a picture of you since, Thu 31 Dec 2009, 13:21, closed)

It really bugs me, this
Violence is never right, and sometimes the perpetrators of domestic violence are women, but it is overwhelmingly a male on female problem.

The last time I checked, you *do* have the same rights as anyone else in this country, so if a woman is treating you that way, leave her. If you can't leave her, there will be a male support group for men suffering domestic violence who will be able to help you to do that.

It is the way certain men manage to control a woman (and her spending, friends, how often she sees her family, whether she can hold her own baby when it cries, what she eats, whether she can visit her sick grandparent in hospital etc), and what that often then leads on to, that causes huge suffering for thousands of women, and, for two women a week (in the UK), death.

The campaigns to protect women are there because there is such a huge need for them to be there, and none of them would deny that men can be victims of DV too.
(floella, Thu 31 Dec 2009, 16:40, closed)

I disagree
Physical violence is more likely to to be happen to a woman, but I have seen far more men who are emotionally abused constantly, and no-one gives a shit about that. Generally what I'm saying is women have no problem at all emotionally destroying their partner (but you're a prick if you do it to them), but on the other side, men are more likely to hit out physically. I disagree with both methods...it's not your job to control your partner , it's theirs.(my philosophy).
BTW here in Australia, the campaigns very blatantly suggest that all males are abusers and women would do no such thing.

I could show the the phone book pages showing 2 pages of womens support groups and 2 listings for mens.
(M61A1 CUPID- STUNTS, Fri 1 Jan 2010, 1:58, closed)

Untruth
You say that it's 'overwhelmingly a male on female problem'.

But that's not true. Chances suffering domestic violence in your lifetime:
Women: 1/4
Men: 1/6

If it was Men: 1/1000, you'd have a point.

Oh and you say two women die per week in the UK. What about the one man?

So, again, why is domestic violence against men ignored and violence against men highlighted as if the converse either didn't exist or was unimportant?
(egg1, Fri 1 Jan 2010, 12:07, closed)

Stats
It's not that simple:
89% of recorded domestic violence victims are female. Looking more closely at the information that's available, females are more likely to suffer repeated attacks over a period of time.

Is it really true that one man per week in the UK dies as a result of domestic abuse?

The original question was "Does that mean that males must accept what women consider abuse? Why?
In our so called advanced society, why am I not afforded the same rights as the vagina owners club?" which I answered - Males do *not* have to accept any form of abuse, and in our advanced Western society, men and women have the same rights.

In answer to your question - In my experience, domestic violence against men is not ignored or treated as if it didn't exist. There was a campaign in the North East (by the police I think) encouraging men to report incidents of domestic violence and get support from local agencies. I think any kind of disrespectful treatment can be hugely damaging depending on the person and the situation. Not forgetting ,of course, that DV causes problems in same-sex relationships too, for men and women.

At no point did I say that I personally think that DV against men doesn't exist or should be ignored (in fact, I think DV against men is probably HUGELY under-reported). Sadly, I have witnessed very closely the sadness destruction it can cause for people. What I did say is that the proportion of women seeking support versus the proportion of males seeking support results in DV groups and agencies being predominantly for women as the respond to demand.
(floella, Fri 1 Jan 2010, 18:13, closed)

I don't know
the depth of your involvement in such issues, but I have had more or less continuous involvement with the Family Law Court (and many other men I know eperience similar). The problem being that, legally we are equals, yet reality is entirely different. I have been accused of the most horrific things by my ex-partner, which are all taken very seriously by the courts, police and Family Services, and helped along by the vast numbers of womens help groups (I get the impression that they, just want to be seen to be helping, without actually checking their facts), yet as a male in this system, I can tell you that it is all very discriminatory, the cops do not care that you may be innocent, the magistrates follow the cops, and Family Services pander non stop to the "poor mother". For the last 16 years I have seen accusations and rulings that I would have never believed possible in today's society.
I don't hate women, I know it may appear that way, but I am appalled at the inequalities that I have witnessed personally, disgusted with the indifference of those who stand by and watch, refusing involvement.I particularly despise those who would stand and say that such women (the ones I have dealt with)are discriminated against and have no fault. These are the people (men and women) that destroy equality, by assuming that one is more innocent than the other.

I don't know how it is in th UK but this is how it is here. To be an employed caucasian Australian Male, put's you right at the bottom of the heap. As for 89% of recorded DV "victims" being female, you can probably adjust that to around 20-30% of actual harm (in Australia), as the first stop for women separating here is to get a DVO which will prevent a man from seeing his kids and removes him from the house, usually the one he's paying for. All of which sets the precedent for the courts, who will decide that because this has been the status quo for the last 3 years (don't worry that is has taken that long to reach a hearing) that will be how it's going to be forever. Because keeping dad away from the kids means more child support and more welfare benefits, it is extremely beneficial for mum to keep him away regardless of the lies that must be told, and there is no shortage of departments full of people who rely on these women to ensure that they have a job to go to, so that they can have somewhere to live and food to eat.
(M61A1 CUPID- STUNTS, Wed 6 Jan 2010, 12:52, closed)

But...
We're not talking about women who make false accusations, we're talking about actual domestic violence. The fact it is hard to prove, and the nature of it, makes it more difficult for everyone - women, men, workers and the justice system...

I'm really sorry to hear about your bad experience and understand how it is difficult for you to remain objective about it. There may be many men in your position, but there are also many women who are unable to prosecute their abusers due to similar flaws in the legal system.
(floella, Wed 6 Jan 2010, 23:19, closed)

Exactly
When there are so many false accusations, it just makes it more difficult for those who are genuinely harmed.
Accusation of violence is a common tool for women involved in family law proceedings, yet there is no punishment for those who caught out perjuring themselves, hence there is no justice for those falsely accused, your name and face forever dirtied.
(M61A1 CUPID- STUNTS, Wed 6 Jan 2010, 23:37, closed)

Here in NZ
The campaign is "Stop Domestic Violence." Against women, against men, against children. Statistically violence occurs towards women much more, but that's no excuse for excluding male victims.
(Holy Gabrielle is Holy, Fri 1 Jan 2010, 10:01, closed)

Yeah but nah
I wondered about this, then it occurred to me. At some point in a man's life (late teens usually) they get the feeling that they can handle themselves in a fight, the feeling is thatif they got in a fight, they would be able to defend themselves well enough to escape. There is a real sense of power and control here. As a man you feel like you can take care of yourself. This is one reason why young men are so violent (the vast majority of victims and perpetrators of violence are young men): they aren't afraid enough to consciously avoid violence. If a man thinks back to when he was a child, he might recall this implicit fear (maybe not the best word) of adults.
This generally never happens for women. They remain with this subtle fear (again not the best word) of men. If a woman has ever been victim of violence, it makes this more acute. So, there can be a real fear that when the man starts yelling, or wanting to control, that real violence could be around the corner. So the fact of being a woman means a different experience of these things.

I think the solution might be for all women to take high level martial arts. It would be interesting to see what would result.
( Sextant goes to him is emotionally erect, on this day, Fri 1 Jan 2010, 11:08, closed)

You speak for yourself
that is utter crap...well the part about women having a subtle fear. In a significant proportion of documented cases, the women know how to push the buttons until they get the male out of control. I have experienced this, although I have never lost it, I have watched as the woman needles and pushes,trying to find the right trigger. I read also of a case of a woman (and several similar) who was a serial punching bag, after being instructed by a support group to cease all contact. This woman persisted in letting her abuser know exactly where she was, and deliberately pushed the buttons until she got her result. In the long run and intervention by a psych it was found that she craved the adrenaline high she got the instant before she was hit. The physical damage was the cost of her addiction.
(M61A1 CUPID- STUNTS, Fri 1 Jan 2010, 23:03, closed)

Thats interesting..
Because those are relatively rare examples.
If I could add another one to the mix.. My parents were violent. My Mum was violent to me. So was my husband, and so was my ex boyfriend. They really only have to raise their hand once. Then you're terrified on a gut level that you'll get a clump round the head, so your behaviour modifies itself, almost without you being aware of it.
I find it interesting that most men don't feel that. At least until it happens to them. I also find it interesting that the last example was (at this distance) obviously ill, and yet she was "asking for it" somehow.. Makes me wonder whether I was...

Thanks for reading, I'll go and find some crude sexist gags now...
(Beer Elf Thought this was like a campfire, anyhow, on, Sat 2 Jan 2010, 13:59, closed)

My point was
that these are not relatively rare examples here, they have been found commonplace.....the results of the study just didn't met the needs of those who ordered it out so it has not been widely publicised.
(M61A1 CUPID- STUNTS, Wed 6 Jan 2010, 12:55, closed)