Catch 22 on the housing ladder
About 2 years ago I bought a flat in addition to our family home. This was going to be the investment to one day retire on. I ran/am running, it as a successful holiday business and jointly own it with my wife.

So last summer she decided she'd rather go drinking and clubbing with her mates and duly booted me out of our house. Due to holiday bookings I couldn't live in the flat of course.

SO now we're going through divorce proceedings I have the lovely catch 22 situation that I can't go and buy a house because I'm listed on a mortgage for a house I don't live in. All other money is tied up in a flat (as another debt) which is jointly owned.

This means if I live in the flat I can't finalise my divorce and get on with my life as it's a joint asset so needs to be sold. However the state of the economy means nobody wants to buy the flat. Well that's not completely true, I have the buyers that want it but can't get a mortgage and the opportunists who think I'm desperate so offer 20% less than the market price.

So I'm stuck in no-mans land. Don't want to live in the flat, can't buy anywhere else unless I sell it. Plus the flat really isn't suitable for my needs anyway.

Even if I rent the place out the tax man will have 40% of any income from it.

Probably sounds like I'm rolling in money, but it's all mortgages/debts etc being just about covered by my salary, so I actually live with my parents again (how depressing) and if I lose my job the bank will take everything anyway.

Thing that pisses me off is the banks/economic troubles are not caused by lending money on robust assets like property but by idiots like HSBC who lend vast unsecured loans to people who can't afford them.

e.g. my ex-sister in law. Knocked up, living in a council flat, no proper income, no assets. Yet HSBC gave her a £20k unsecured loan!?!? No surprises she had problems paying it back, but it's not like the bank can seize anything of value when she has fuck all.


If the outcome of this whole "credit crunch" is that people can get mortgages but not unsecured loans then it's a good thing in my opinion. After all if you can't afford to buy something, you shouldn't have it.
(golddust QOTW now revolves around being a cunt, Thu 22 Jan 2009, 15:50, 11 replies)

Hmmmm
......."can't afford to buy something, you shouldn't have it".

So you bought your properties cash?

No, you borrowed on assets that were massively overpriced at the time and now, if I read your post correctly, your circumstances are that YOU "can't afford" them. So, by your own logic, you "shouldn't have them".
(Captain Placid 24/7 ball gags, brownie mix and clown porn, Thu 22 Jan 2009, 15:59, closed)

On the contrary
both places are worth more than any debt associated with them.

The problem is that on the house my ex-wife lives in I'm named on the mortgage, which prevents me getting a mortgage anywhere else as technically I'm liable for the mortgage on the house, even though she pays it herself.

On the flat it's jointly owned, so in order to complete the divorce it's needs to be sold to eradicate the joint ownership. The costs of the flat are covered by a tennant, so no problems there. It's just that in order to move on in my life I need to sell the flat, so I can finish my divorce and formally be declared independent financially.

So the situation is I/we CAN afford the properties, I just can't do anything to change my circumstances.
(golddust QOTW now revolves around being a cunt, Thu 22 Jan 2009, 16:32, closed)

Can't you get your name taken off the house mortgage and your ex-wife's name taken off the flat mortgage/loan and haggle up the difference in value between yourself?

That way, no sale needed; she keeps the house, you keep the flat, and one of you owes the other whatever the equity difference stands at?
(Musuko, Thu 22 Jan 2009, 17:47, closed)

No
She doesn't earn enough for the bank to let her have a sole mortgage, yet she pays it each month.
(golddust QOTW now revolves around being a cunt, Fri 23 Jan 2009, 9:04, closed)

...
"Yet HSBC gave her a £20k unsecured loan!?!? "
What the funk?
(tweebianmonkey Should be known as Widget, Thu 22 Jan 2009, 16:04, closed)

I know!
It's totally ridiculous!

When I wrote to the bank on her behalf pointing out a change in her circumstances and attempting to setup a voluntary agreement to repay the debt in lower amounts if they paused or reduced the interest (otherwise any repayment was less than the interest!) they totally ignored the letter. Then when pressed said they wouldn't make any alternative arrangements and instead threatened the bailiffs.

Our repsonse was, "well, how that will help the bank? There are no assets to repossess, so any bailiff will fail to recover money. Or if you press for bankruptcy then the debt is lost anyway!?"

So ironically even when offering the repay the bank what you can, they'd rather get nothing.

In the end someone with common sense sorted out a new agreement with lower interest over a longer term.

I still say she shouldn't have applied for the loan in the first place and worse still HSBC shouldn't have given it to her!
(golddust QOTW now revolves around being a cunt, Thu 22 Jan 2009, 16:37, closed)

"Market Price"
If you're unable to sell a property at a price, it's above the market price.
(Richy_T hundreds if not thousands of dollars, Thu 22 Jan 2009, 16:25, closed)

That's the irony
It's bang on with comparable properties and what people seem to think is fair, but so far we've had 3 buyers pull out when they've failed to qualify for the mortgage they've needed.

One couple, both full time permanently employed with decent incomes and a 10% deposit but didn't qualify for a £90k mortgage between them!
(golddust QOTW now revolves around being a cunt, Thu 22 Jan 2009, 16:39, closed)

£20k unsecured loan
and HSBC are supposedly the only UK bank that isn't up shit creek, wtf have the others been up to?
( stopmeandslapme Cometh the hour, cometh your mum, Thu 22 Jan 2009, 18:26, closed)

Exactly!
Everytime you get those junk mail letters through the door saying "borrow more money!" you have to wonder how many people just do without questionning if they can afford it.

It's clear to me the banks are up the creek because they lent money under the wrong circumstances to the wrong people.
(golddust QOTW now revolves around being a cunt, Fri 23 Jan 2009, 9:06, closed)

I sympathise with you...
Not that I'm in the same position, but I understand how annoying the whole situation must be.
One minute you're doing well, 2 properties, own business, etc. The next, you're in shit creek, mainly because you've actually got something to loose.
If you'd had fuck all to start off with, it probably wouldn't seem so bad.
That's the problem with the welfare state that doesn't accurately access each persons needs.
"Got nowt, then here's some money - despite having pissed it all up the wall"
"Got something, we'll have that until you are broke. Oh, and fuck off".
(Kliper Filllets Getting noticed by twats on the internet since, Fri 23 Jan 2009, 12:55, closed)