So giving Mugabe
more money is justified because some other leaders will get money for public services?
( sprinkles ITS AN ISLAND, morron, Sat 2 Jul 2005, 10:47, archived)

I'm not saying that won't happen.
I am saying less people will die and Africans will have a chance at a better life.

So you'd rather let those with good intent starve as well as those under Mugabe?
( ArthurTheRat, Sat 2 Jul 2005, 10:49, archived)

www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/L20595723.htm
( Mykeyboy A massive, salty filing cabinet, Sat 2 Jul 2005, 10:51, archived)

Any major change in Africa
has to come from Africa itself.
The West can't really do much, aside from changing the trade laws to make it fairer and the basic humanitarian aid to the worst-affected parts.
Throwing cheques at the problem isn't going to make it go away, and all Live8 will do is boost the reputation of pop stars and make middle-class students feel good about themselves.

But that doesn't mean that you're not a cunt.
( Comma, Sat 2 Jul 2005, 10:54, archived)

I just wish Geldof would die

( Mykeyboy A massive, salty filing cabinet, Sat 2 Jul 2005, 10:56, archived)

Anyone who calls their daughter
Fifi Trixibelle deserves hideous body mutilation and arsecunting with a large hammer.
( Comma, Sat 2 Jul 2005, 11:00, archived)

This.
Even the cunt part.
( sprinkles ITS AN ISLAND, morron, Sat 2 Jul 2005, 10:58, archived)

but the people who are marching to show their support for sorting it
deserve to be bombed? Hope you were nice to Dekazer last time you spoke to her.

There are b3tans on the Edinburgh march.
( icklepeach *relurks*, Sat 2 Jul 2005, 11:01, archived)

I've never
spoken to Dekazer.
( sprinkles ITS AN ISLAND, morron, Sat 2 Jul 2005, 11:02, archived)

Also, im wondering what happens when the debts been cancelled
And then they start to run up more debt... cancel that again?
( Mykeyboy A massive, salty filing cabinet, Sat 2 Jul 2005, 11:08, archived)

Yeah But Dekazer is a psuedohippy
She doesnt count;)
( Mykeyboy A massive, salty filing cabinet, Sat 2 Jul 2005, 11:02, archived)

I agree.
But it's not throwing cheques at it.

If you cancel the debt (which isn't done without strict conditions on where that money goes) then the country can start building it's infrastructures again, investing etc.

Some people talking about Africa as if it's one country with one president! It's not.
( icklepeach *relurks*, Sat 2 Jul 2005, 10:59, archived)

Or the leader
can get a nice new jet.
( sprinkles ITS AN ISLAND, morron, Sat 2 Jul 2005, 11:01, archived)

Arf!
Its not like the leaders are going to say 'Golly now we've got no debt we should really change our corrupt genocidal ways' is it...

edit: news.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2005/06/25/wnig25.xml
( Mykeyboy A massive, salty filing cabinet, Sat 2 Jul 2005, 11:04, archived)

Yes, there are corrupt leaders,
but that doesn't mean that we shouldn't help those countries with diplomatic governments whose people are suffering because of debt and unfair trade laws.
( Comma, Sat 2 Jul 2005, 11:08, archived)

Agreed
But we would be giving money to all of them, even the corrupt ones
( Mykeyboy A massive, salty filing cabinet, Sat 2 Jul 2005, 11:10, archived)

What would you suggest the alternative is?

(s0WmVHAwZgpG, Sat 2 Jul 2005, 11:12, archived)

I dunno, err maybe letting a mineral rich continent pay its debt back
Without taking the imperialist attitude that they can only be helped by us and not themselves
( Mykeyboy A massive, salty filing cabinet, Sat 2 Jul 2005, 11:16, archived)

re-colinisation

( sprinkles ITS AN ISLAND, morron, Sat 2 Jul 2005, 11:17, archived)

I'm sorry if I'm being stupid here,
but is there any reason why we can't only give money to countries with stable democratic governments?
( Comma, Sat 2 Jul 2005, 11:12, archived)

None
Thats not what im saying
( Mykeyboy A massive, salty filing cabinet, Sat 2 Jul 2005, 11:13, archived)

no
There would be a systematic plan of structured debt relief requiring the meeting of strict conditions.
( icklepeach *relurks*, Sat 2 Jul 2005, 11:13, archived)

If you believe that then thats blind ignorance
Tell me now, which particular bit of aid ever given to Africa went in its entirety where it was supposed to and not to line the pockets of officials?
( Mykeyboy A massive, salty filing cabinet, Sat 2 Jul 2005, 11:15, archived)

I know two people
in Nigeria. They both have digital satellite and a 1mb web connection.
( sprinkles ITS AN ISLAND, morron, Sat 2 Jul 2005, 11:15, archived)

So because
the two people in Africa that you know are wealthy, there is no poverty and no need for aid or any kind of western intervention?
( Comma, Sat 2 Jul 2005, 11:17, archived)

The way
you lefties bang on about it, you'd swear they were still living in tribes.
( sprinkles ITS AN ISLAND, morron, Sat 2 Jul 2005, 11:24, archived)

This.
'Africa' isn't just one solid blotch that can be cured by the west's magic wand.
Rich countries should try to help poorer countries as much as possible, but each African nation's fate ultimately lies in its individual hands.
( Comma, Sat 2 Jul 2005, 11:03, archived)

They haven't got much hope without a little
help/interference from the rest of the world, though.
(s0WmVHAwZgpG, Sat 2 Jul 2005, 11:04, archived)