I sometimes think that if you remove the pointless blockchainand the silly prices then there is a kernel of an idea in it all. People like collecting, and digital artists are ripped off by existing sites expecting them to work for free. It feels like there must be some way to make collecting digital art cool without burning the planet.
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monkeon schmonkeon,
Thu 7 Apr 2022, 23:26,
archived)
yeah, I take your point and hope that some can make hay while the sun shines. It's similar to the piracy thing as it struggled to adapt from physical mediaif something can be effortlessly copied perfectly a zillion times, what value does an instance of it have?
it's a difficult somewhat metaphysical question, but I think with NFTs it's how much do other people value it, and I think this is inflated because of its novelty, which is wearing off. Eventually the question will be, how is this copy actually any different to any other identical copy, apart from having some invisible NFT metadata that you've paid for attached to the file? It's not the same as physical art. there's only one Sunflowers. You can say one of the prints is the official van gogh foundation print, but if it's identical to prints anyone can buy people aren't going to pay much for it. The essential problem is that though the NFT is unique, the digital copy of the artwork isn't, and which is really the thing that you value. A code or the artwork?
In piracy it's been about trying and mostly failing to enforce uniqueness and copyright through enforcement, and ending up with spotify where nobody but spotify makes any money
(it's a difficult somewhat metaphysical question, but I think with NFTs it's how much do other people value it, and I think this is inflated because of its novelty, which is wearing off. Eventually the question will be, how is this copy actually any different to any other identical copy, apart from having some invisible NFT metadata that you've paid for attached to the file? It's not the same as physical art. there's only one Sunflowers. You can say one of the prints is the official van gogh foundation print, but if it's identical to prints anyone can buy people aren't going to pay much for it. The essential problem is that though the NFT is unique, the digital copy of the artwork isn't, and which is really the thing that you value. A code or the artwork?
In piracy it's been about trying and mostly failing to enforce uniqueness and copyright through enforcement, and ending up with spotify where nobody but spotify makes any money
cumquat may will not be commenting further on the allegations,
Fri 8 Apr 2022, 1:21,
archived)
i realise I've waffled on without suggesting a solution to the problem you raised, sorryfor nft's problems, I don't know what's a better solution for ripped off artists either.
btw, I was joking about selling the simpsons pic on opensea in the thread above, but looking at their terms the best you can get is a takedown, there's no mechanism for compensation if someone takes payment for selling an NFT for work they've stolen (which is possibly Anthonyb3ta3000 business model unless he's pure mentalist), so NFTs don't guarantee against the same issues
(btw, I was joking about selling the simpsons pic on opensea in the thread above, but looking at their terms the best you can get is a takedown, there's no mechanism for compensation if someone takes payment for selling an NFT for work they've stolen (which is possibly Anthonyb3ta3000 business model unless he's pure mentalist), so NFTs don't guarantee against the same issues
cumquat may will not be commenting further on the allegations,
Fri 8 Apr 2022, 1:56,
archived)
NFTs are shit and mostly bought by peoplewith no interest in art.
However, it does feel like there are enough people who want to buy things like skins for games, that if there was a centralised place where digital artists could sell bespoke artwork or take commissions, then there is an audience for that. I don't think there is a place where people can browse such things at the moment that aren't NFT based.
If nothing else, NFTs show that with enough marketing budget you can get people to want to buy a digital picture to be in the cool club (even if I suspect most of them don't know what they have actually bought).
I think I can see how a Bandcampy approach could work for digital art, though you'd need someone with lots of money, deals with game makers, and a desire to do right by the artists, or such a site would just end up as Red Bubble and printing your picture on a pair of y-fronts.
(However, it does feel like there are enough people who want to buy things like skins for games, that if there was a centralised place where digital artists could sell bespoke artwork or take commissions, then there is an audience for that. I don't think there is a place where people can browse such things at the moment that aren't NFT based.
If nothing else, NFTs show that with enough marketing budget you can get people to want to buy a digital picture to be in the cool club (even if I suspect most of them don't know what they have actually bought).
I think I can see how a Bandcampy approach could work for digital art, though you'd need someone with lots of money, deals with game makers, and a desire to do right by the artists, or such a site would just end up as Red Bubble and printing your picture on a pair of y-fronts.
monkeon schmonkeon,
Fri 8 Apr 2022, 10:43,
archived)
As someone who both collects and creates NFTs, and with a healthy skepticism too...I can say that the value is not really in the artwork, it's in the hash (so pretty much code). You are paying for a string numbers, of which the artwork may or may not be secondary. The number is a signifier or uniqueness, not the artwork. Pretty silly to pay for a string of numbers? Well, yes I suppose. But sillier than paying for a piece of paper used to post letters? Or sillier than countless other things people like to collect? Just because it's in the digital realm and not physical?
Another interesting thing with NFTs is the code enables more than just jpegs on blockchain. They can be used as keys to open things or membership, they can be used as in-game assets, they can be used a digital identity avatars in metaverse worlds.
I get the hate, but also a lot of it of comes from a position of some ignorance...
(Another interesting thing with NFTs is the code enables more than just jpegs on blockchain. They can be used as keys to open things or membership, they can be used as in-game assets, they can be used a digital identity avatars in metaverse worlds.
I get the hate, but also a lot of it of comes from a position of some ignorance...
ProjectWeasel The Bird is the Word,
Fri 8 Apr 2022, 10:22,
archived)
As someone who both collects and creates NFTs, I would like you to send me your bank details
mofaha ┐( ˘_˘)┌ ʅ(́◡◝)ʃ,
Fri 8 Apr 2022, 12:39,
archived)
hate really is too strong a wordfor the profound but fleeting contempt felt by most people for those who play any part in the nft market.
i have no problem with the concept - i think it's a very clever application of blockchain - but unsurprisingly, it's just another chapter in the history of human cuntery.
and just like that, i couldn't care less.
(,
Fri 8 Apr 2022, 12:50,
archived)
i have no problem with the concept - i think it's a very clever application of blockchain - but unsurprisingly, it's just another chapter in the history of human cuntery.
and just like that, i couldn't care less.
I appreciate the explanation, which somewhat confirms my idle speculation about itgood luck to you, though I suspect as with bitcoin those coming late to party will find people have had their fun, left, and pissed in the punch.
( cumquat may will not be commenting further on the allegations,
Fri 8 Apr 2022, 15:08,
archived)