Pessimism
I am currently doing a law degree. I have always wanted to be a barrister, and the only reason I do this stupid, boring course, is because I want to make the world a better place and have no hope of being a police officer (am practically blind without glasses - not Penfold blind, but actually blind blind). However, I have recently decided to sod the barrister thing (once I have finished my degree, it will cost me £12,500 to do a one year course. To be a barrister, after this, I have to do a 2 year 'pupillage', which is like an apprenticeship. Only 15% of applicants get a pupillage. So, only the fucking 'hooray Henrys' on my course have even a fighting chance. I can't afford to gamble £12,500 (plus expenses for the 12 dinners I would have to go to in London - I work in a pub in the north to support my degree and can't take weekends off). )

So, I have to pin my hopes for the WHOLE OF MY LIFE on getting (even an admin) job in the CPS. I was so optimisic when I decided to go into law. I love the law, I am good at it. I have always wanted to go into criminal law. But no. I can't afford to do it. Here is an email I got from the head of the School of Law the other day: ****For summary, scroll down****

Subject: Career opportunities in law


Career opportunities in law : statistics (and implications for current UGs/PGs)
[The following statistics mainly come from the Training Contract and Pupillage Handbook 2009].

With increasing competition for training contracts and pupillages it is becoming more important for students not only to have a strong academic profile but also possess evidence of the acquisition of relevant skills. In this regard I would draw your attention to the following skills-related activities which you can engage in whilst undertaking your degree in ***** :

1. Mooting competition organised by D**** P*****/LawSoc.

2. Negotiation competition sponsored by DLA Piper solicitors (J**** B***** and S** W**** - 2 second year LLB students have won a place in the national final of the negotiation competition to be held on 28th March 2009). This competition is organised in the law school by N**** S****** and the LawSoc (R***** A*** and A** W********).

3. Debating competition sponsored by Allen and Overy solicitors (organised by LawSoc)

4. Interviewing competition (it is hoped that the student's LawSoc will be able to find sponsorship for this competition next year).

5. The range of pro bono activities organised by H****** K*** and L**** B*******-H***.

The following statistics make sobering reading.

Pupillages
2005-2006 = 515
2006-2007 = 527
2007-2008 = 419 (ie 15% of 2,870 applicants were successful)

Vacancies appear set for a steady decline.

Training contracts
2006-2007 = 6012 (up from 5751 in 2005-2006)

The effect of the 'credit crunch' is bound to reduce the number of training contracts which are available over (at least) the next 2-3 years.

LPC places in 2007-2008
Full time = 10675
Part time = 3064

Successful completion of LPC
5921 in 2006-2007
Current success rate is 75%

It is estimated that there is currently a 'pool' of over 17,000 applicants for training contracts who are currently studying for the LPC or who have completed the course but have not yet secured a training contract.

Training contracts in 2006-2007 by employment type :
Private practice = 93.9%
Commerce and industry = 2.3%
Government department = 0.4%
Local government = 1.7%
Court services = 0.4%
Advise services = 0.5%
Crown Prosecution Service = 0.6%
Other 0.3%

Training contracts in 2006-2007 by size of private practice firm
More than 81 partners = 33.2%
26-80 = 16.8%
11-25 = 13.7%
5-10 = 12.9%
2-4 = 17.6%
Sole practitioner = 5.7%

Training contracts 2006-2007 by geographical region
Central London = 26.2%
Greater London = 21.2%
Southeast = 8.4%
Southwest = 3.8%
Wales = 3.1%
West Midlands = 6.6%
Northwest = 11.3%
Northeast = 2.8%
Yorkshire and Humberside = 6.9%
East Midlands = 3.8%
Eastern counties = 5.8%

Law graduates (per annum)
12,858 in 2006.
In addition to the 12,858 LLB graduates there are 2,500 GDL graduates (conversion course graduates) and 4,000 others with qualifying (ie joint) law degrees.

The Legal Services Act 2007 will enable multidisciplinary practices to be set up (so called 'Tesco Law') and when this comes into effect it is likely to have an impact on the availability of work currently undertaken by some lawyers. Multidisciplinary practices are therefore likely to comprise a small proportion of lawyers and a larger proportion of paralegals and/or other professionals. A partner in a High Street practice in London I recently spoke to was pessimistic about the affect this will have on the availability of work typically undertaken by high street practices.

The message from these statistics is clear - you need to be a 'well rounded' applicant with good university grades AND sufficient evidence of the acquisition of skills gained either within a university context or whilst undertaking vacation placement work.

N*** S*****,
26.3.2009

****SUMMARY: If you need a job to support you, so you can't take all the time you need to do extra-curricular, and you don't have Mother and Father to introduce you to all the lawyers you'll ever need to know - YOU'RE FUCKED****


Right. I made the correct degree choice then.



I will probably never be made redundant from the pub (touch wood), but fuck me - is that not shit? What the fuck have I devoted my life to? I have always wanted to be a barrister so I could do the right thing, but that will now just be left to the fucking rich, white kids with money to burn. My dream was always difficult to realise, but the recession has made it impossible for a working class girl, no matter how intelligent, to realise.



Rant over.



Length? Three years, immeasurable boredom. For nothing.
(BelladonnaAnodyne Melissa's gonna wet herself, I swear..., Sat 4 Apr 2009, 0:46, 13 replies)

I wish there was an "I don't like this, but it is SO damn true" button
I was in a similar position to you during uni.... got told that the only way to make my degree seem worthwhile was to do some kind of unpaid work/internships during vacations and such. Which would have been fine and dandy, if I hadn't had to do (paid!)work in factories during my summer vacations to help me pay my way through uni (couldn't even get office work, because I didn't have any experience... how the heck was I supposed to GET any experience?! :/)

The rich get richer...
(catbearmouse, Sat 4 Apr 2009, 1:28, closed)

It's not that
I've done work experience, I even beat 50 people to get a work experience placement with the CPS that finishes a week before my exams start (Yeah. Argh) . What we're being told is basically 'even if you're good, even if you've done all the work experience you can, unless you can afford £12k, and 3 years unpaid, it's pointless...'
(BelladonnaAnodyne Melissa's gonna wet herself, I swear..., Sat 4 Apr 2009, 1:33, closed)

i work in a top 10 city law firm
as of this afternoon, i'm on formal consultation for redundancy, along with my entire practice group. a substantial number will be going.

my old firm has told all its trainees there will be no jobs when they qualify.

it fucking sucks. but have you thought (and you probably have, sorry if this is patronising) about applying for a training contract at a law firm that specialises in criminal law? then you could move over to the cps and retrain as a barrister when times improve?
( rachelswipe with a fork, Sat 4 Apr 2009, 1:45, closed)

Cocking fuck
This sucks, sorry to hear it. Same everywhere. (See below).
(Dr Funkenstein - back in the civilised world, Sat 4 Apr 2009, 1:50, closed)

Shite shite and more shite
Mate, I just want to wish you luck. Look, the thing is that all this crap will pass. I left uni in 2001 and worked loads of different jobs, some good, some fucking awful, but basically had no idea what I wanted to do, just drifting along and assuming some day things would work out.

I eventually copped on to the fact that I wanted to do graphics - I'd always kind of known it, but not being exactly brilliant at art had never actually thought I could do it. So, jacked in the career, went back to uni, studied for another degree, did well, graduated, thought "well, what with my new degree and previous experience, I'm bound to get a good job, right?" Wrong. I graduated into the cocking recession. No work for months and months. Countless applications - literally hundreds and all I got was rejection after rejection - in fact mostly people couldn't even be arsed to write me a rejection letter.

Eventually I got an internship at a charity, worked for free for a month, and now, even though they're skint, they've worked something out so that I can stay on, on an ad hoc, freelance basis, when there's work, they'll pay me to do it, when there isn't, I'll sit at home and play on b3ta!

Point is, the reason they did this was not that I'm an amazing designer (I'm really really NOT!) but because I showed that I loved what I do, work hard at it, want to help them out and try to be useful around the place. From your post above I think you'd be the same. You sound like a dedicated person who loves their subject and would be an asset to any company. YOU WILL MAKE IT.

I know it's really shit at the moment, and believe me, six weeks ago I was fucking despairing of getting anything, but life turns on the little things, and if you can show to a law firm the passion you write with, I think they'll try to give you that placement.

Haven't posted in ages, but wanted to write this to keep your chin up.

Good luck then, hope things start looking up for you.



Length - 3 months on the fucking dole. No apologies!

Love

The Dr Funkenstein
(Dr Funkenstein - back in the civilised world, Sat 4 Apr 2009, 1:48, closed)

...
It's not true that only rich kids can get into the profession, and I don't see how being white has anything to do with it, there's no need at all to bring race into it. I've had some work experience with a criminal barrister and they definitely aren't all white and rich.

And where have you got the idea that you have to do 3 years unpaid? All training contracts are paid and pupillages (which only last 1 year) have a guaranteed award for the first 6 and earnings in the second 6.

Why not take the LPC and try to become a crown advocate, or aim to get a job with a private firm which specialises in criminal law (perhaps become a solicitor advocate)? Also the recession does not have the same effect on crime rates as it does on the economy so it's hard to see how the recession will damage the number of jobs in criminal law. Those statistics will be skewed by redundancies in commercial firms.

Did you not look into what becoming a lawyer involved before you started your degree? Because if you did you surely must have known that you would have to pay through the nose for your BVC/LPC, and that becoming a barrister has been ridiculously competitive for a long time. It's true that taking the LPC/BVC is a risk but you should have known that before you started.

Sorry if this post is a bit blunt but I'm in a similar position to you (work in an abbatoir instead of a factory over summer though) and it definitely isn't as bad as you're making out. I can't afford to pay for my fourth year so I'm going to do what countless other people have to do, work and save for a year after uni and then take out a career development loan. If you were really going to struggle you could take the LPC/BVC part time and work while you were studying. I do agree that dining at the inns is a joke though, I literally couldn't afford to do it when I got the chance last year.

Also, have you thought about applying to one of the inns for a scholarship? They give out over £3million a year in scholarships and bursaries so it might be worth a try, especially if you've done well in mooting.

There's no reason that a person with a good degree, decent work experience and the right attitude can't get a job in a criminal law firm or with the CPS, regardless of whether or not they're rich and white.

You're obviously going to get a good degree, showing that you worked through uni looks great on a CV and will compensate for lack of extra curriculars, and it also looks like you've got some brilliant work experience. Stop being so pessimistic.
(discodavey, Sat 4 Apr 2009, 3:53, closed)

^^THIS^^
I've recently considered retraining as a barrister, despite having no legal education at all. It can be done - it's hard, but it can be done.

The first thing you should do is to look to the Inns of Court for funding. It's not massively generous, but it's probably enough. Inner Temple is the most valuable, but the others are not to be sniffed at.

Now - I've decided against applying, because at my age - I'm 32 - I think it's a bit late to be starting from scratch (and I only got my first job less than three years ago, so I'm not exactly loaded). But if you're now in your early 20s, the investment is, in a sense, much smaller.

As it happens, I work with a lot of barristers. It's true that many are stereotypical WASP types - but that's a generational thing. Of those who're my age, sex, race and culture don't seem to be nearly as big a factor (which stands to reason, really: an Inn will want the best people, and best doesn't mean whitest or most middle-class).
( Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Sat 4 Apr 2009, 12:15, closed)

Meh...
The problem is really that I can't afford to go to any of the events at the inns, or I don't get the chance to because I'm at work. Studying is made more difficult by the fact that I spend all my time working. Why would the inns support me when they've never met me or anything? My grades aren't massively exceptional (2.1 average - but that's considered the minimum - except in criminal law).



I didn't mean for what I said to be so studiously analysed or for it to be a searing indictment of the state of the legal system. I did know how difficult it was going to be before I started uni, but then, because I'd always been top of the class since I was 4, I rather optimistically thought uni would be easy for me too (I have been brought back down to earth with a horrendous bump).

All I wanted was a little bit of catharsis, and the chance to have a little rant in between the revision.

However, thanks for people being nice and stuff. I feel a bit fuzzy inside.
(BelladonnaAnodyne Melissa's gonna wet herself, I swear..., Sat 4 Apr 2009, 13:17, closed)

Don't give up
From a fellow student (chemistry) with dreams of making the world a better place, don't give up. You will get there if you are determined enough. There's no point looking at it and going "Oh I'm probably not going to get there so I won't even try" cos then you've lost before you've even started. And the recession won't last forever. Have a little faith.
(Petite chien is going to do science to it, Sat 4 Apr 2009, 12:36, closed)

WAIT A MINUTE
YOU ARE NOT WHITE, YOU ARE FEMALE AND YOU ARE DISABLED, IE LEGALLY BLIND?

SURELY ANYONE WOULD BE FAR TOO TERRIFIED OF A COMBINED RACE AND SEX AND DISABILITY CLAIM NOT TO GIVE YOU FUNDING/HIRE YOU?
(Itsme Beaverwax, Sat 4 Apr 2009, 12:44, closed)

heh...
I'm not legally blind, just too blind without my glasses to be in the police. I am white, but I felt like getting a bit political. I am a girl though!
(BelladonnaAnodyne Melissa's gonna wet herself, I swear..., Sat 4 Apr 2009, 13:19, closed)

So much for meritocracy.
It's like the last 50 years never happened.

The way things are going, it seems that if you're from the C sector or below, the only way to climb the social ladder is to learn a trade. Wish I'd done that instead.
( The Mock TurtIe ™ --- Thinks you are a cunt, on, Sun 5 Apr 2009, 6:16, closed)

Wow
That's one long rant. Those were also my exact thoughts in 2006 when I was deciding whether to apply for the BVC. I didn't have connections, my parents weren't any help financially post-degree (they re-mortgaged twice to help pay for uni) and I had read the same figures re: pupillage figures declining.

I got the £25k professional development loan from Natwest, and went for it. £12k fees, £13k to live on in London (which was ok). I worked part-time during the course (more or less full-time on occasion), and tried to get mini-pupillages. I got none. I got rejected from more than 30 sets. I got pupillage with the CPS, and started straight after the BVC. I was one of the lucky ones, I know many good people who didn't get pupillage, and the traditional refuge of the City isn't what it was.

Don't give up, and if you are determined to make it, you will make it.

All the advice offered by others above is sound. I don't want to fuel your pessimism, but the criminal bar is VERY hard-pressed at the moment, in-house jobs, especially in crime, and most especially with the CPS, are like gold-dust. Don't rule out the LPC, the opportunities are out there.

At the self-employed criminal Bar, pupillage will be up to £20k, solicitors won't pay you for months (even years), you'll be travelling ridiculous distances on the train, and even when you are eventually paid, it will be peanuts. Expect to be in debt for the first 5 years of practice, probably longer.

Good luck, you're aiming at what I think is the best job in the world, and despite the difficulties, I certainly wouldn't swap it for anything. You won't regret it.



/serious advice from interweb strangers.

Edited to add gloom.
(Exiled Youth [witty comment], Sun 5 Apr 2009, 8:10, closed)