think i've got life the universe and everything sussed here...
re: our invisible friend. So, no one knows what happens when we snuff it. The overwhelming likelihood is not very much. Ever been unconscious?

But no – when offered an incomprehensible, inconceivable jumble of superstitions, fairy tales and bogeyman stories rewritten recycled and Chinese whispered down the ages by control freaks and charlatans - you are CERTAIN beyond all doubt that despite all the vast wonder of all existence there is a creator, who (while having a universe to run) is obsessed with your every move thought and action. Oh and you can wish for stuff too.

An all powerful intangible invisible friend and protector – sounds pretty cool. You must be immune to all illness, earthquakes and injury then. No?

Our essential natural urges are shameful and evil?

Your creator is jealous, intolerant, violent, vindictive, spiteful, pernicious and vengeful – but he loves you?

I should terrify my tiny innocent child with assurances this invisible character is waiting in the shadows to punish him for questioning any of this whilst conversely insisting he only deals in truth and that ghosts and goblins are just camp fire tales?

You insist you require no proof for this but continually strive to find bolt-on bits and bobs of science that support your crackpot ideas - the same science that you continually deny.

If my crackpot jumble of superstitions varies even slightly from yours we should devote all our energies to annihilation in a manner that contradicts the few worthwhile parts of your crazy code of divine conduct?

We have the technology to split the atom and unravel DNA but your preference is to split humanity into one half who believe dinosaurs were a prank and another half who believe women should be bundled up and passed around like parcels by men who think it’s a splendid idea to chop off rather crucial bits of anatomy.

We see ourselves as an advanced civilisation yet it was twenty or so years after landing a man on the moon before we realised wheels on a suitcase might be helpful.

Doesn’t bode well does it?
( spimf ™ is whoever you want him to be, Sun 16 Oct 2011, 1:26, 22 replies)

as is this, a pea that is
sorry
( spimf ™ is whoever you want him to be, Sun 16 Oct 2011, 1:40, closed)

Simple, it's faith
Faith that there is an eternal reward for the hardships endured here. If I'm wrong, no harm done. I believe in evolution and I believe the Bible supports it(books of Job and Elijah). I also believe you are free to believe whatever you wish and I will neither hate nor judge you based on your beliefs. I will not say you are wrong and no one has come back from the dead and proven which view is correct, and no one will.

Aha! You say! Jesus supposedly died and came back and you just claimed no one has. There is no proof other than a book with a suspicious past. I believe the message of that book and faith is proof enough for me.

All the same, some nice hard evidence(quiet in the back) would help us all.

Sorry for length.
(CactusZack Shaved his coin purse on, Sun 16 Oct 2011, 9:50, closed)

pity not the fool, for he lives in a better world than you or I
that would be all very jolly, with village fetes, vicars and tea

unfortunately fuckers are slaughtering each other over that claptrap

primitive oppressive dangerous nonsense
( spimf ™ is whoever you want him to be, Sun 16 Oct 2011, 10:33, closed)

Well put. The things people do in the name of religion is enough that a valid argument for it's outlaw can be made.
I would then be an outlaw were that to happen, but I will not support those assholes who kill, molest, and generally make the world worse in the name of religion. You atheists are generally better Christians than Christians and that is sad.

And I would gladly be the fool to hope for a better place and believe that it is in the after. I hate the thought of nothing after we die. and I'm probably going to hell anyway and if that's the case I'd rather be an atheist and hope for nothing after death.

And absurdly I agree with your last line.
(CactusZack Shaved his coin purse on, Sun 16 Oct 2011, 11:38, closed)

so did you also hate the thought of nothing before you were born?

( spimf ™ is whoever you want him to be, Sun 16 Oct 2011, 11:41, closed)

pop
that was my mind. You just blew it with the nothing before i was born. Thanks for changing my life.
(SkoaL, Sun 16 Oct 2011, 13:03, closed)

i doubt theres enough there for a decent pop

( spimf ™ is whoever you want him to be, Sun 16 Oct 2011, 14:25, closed)

Wha?
"...and faith is proof enough for me."

I'm glad that you point out that faith is a personal thing, but that sentence makes no sense to me at all.
(flimflam_machine, Mon 17 Oct 2011, 11:21, closed)

Since when was foreskin crucial?
(TheJacksonSixth, Sun 16 Oct 2011, 13:57, closed)

i was more thinking of the hands of petty criminals and the heads of infadels and blasphemers
but yeah, chopping part of your genitals off for the sake of some crackpot dogma. that's a great idea.

let me put it this way - if your god made your earthly form in his own image, is it not slightly arrogant to think you can make it more godly by snipping bits off - did your god get the design wrong and you know better. what next? ceremonial tonsillectomy? bonkers.
( spimf ™ is whoever you want him to be, Sun 16 Oct 2011, 14:21, closed)

Moses on the top of Mount Sinai ...
He gazes into a blazing rent in the heavens ... a chasm of brilliance which has cloven realiy to reveal the Almighty, that he may deliver his testament to man, his greatest creation.

Moses clears his throat, and says: "...... Sorry, you want us to cut the tip off of what?"

I rest m'case.
(El Fandango carved a big EF onto his nemesis' doublet on .., Sun 16 Oct 2011, 18:53, closed)

Beat me to it!

I was just going to post:

Religion
Whats all that about then?
(SigourneysBeaver took off and nuked the entire site from orbit on, Sun 16 Oct 2011, 18:05, closed)

Explaining a disbelief in God is easy
Try explaining your irrational belief in Free Will, then.

And, for a bonus point, where does 'will' comes from? The physical universe always follows the path of least resistance. Except Life. Why?
(CADmonkey rollllllllled another one, just like the other one, Sun 16 Oct 2011, 18:34, closed)

well we could bang on for hours...
about secular humanism and such and ponder over the similarities between humans and troupes of chimps who seemingly make war on their neighbours and noodle about over the differences. but all that infers that it somehow matters. The whole point is we don't matter at all. We are a barely evolved species clinging to our little rock whizzing through the universe. Our planet will survive without us and quickly recover from any damage we do. then evolution will pick some other species out and give them a shot, which is precisely the path of least resistance, life prevails, it needs no reason. the problem is the god botherers seem to think we're central to some grand plan of the universe when we are in fact utterly insignificant. if we gained some humility from that realisation, we might actually begin to value the brief lives we have and stop snuffing each other out over how we wear our facial hair or choose to modify our genitalia.
( spimf ™ is whoever you want him to be, Sun 16 Oct 2011, 20:14, closed)

fuck the chimps
i'm energy. i'm alive and i'm aware. i'm not going to let such petty notions as 'time' & 'space' get in the way of that.

Blimey and i haven't even had my weetabix yet
(CADmonkey rollllllllled another one, just like the other one, Mon 17 Oct 2011, 8:45, closed)

go pan dimensional CADmonkey! GO!*
*not a pan dimensional toy. alcohol required.
( spimf ™ is whoever you want him to be, Mon 17 Oct 2011, 15:41, closed)

*demonstrates karate chop action*

(CADmonkey rollllllllled another one, just like the other one, Mon 17 Oct 2011, 16:58, closed)

impressive

( spimf ™ is whoever you want him to be, Mon 17 Oct 2011, 17:27, closed)

Ever read The Brothers Karamazov?
It's very Russian (ie. a huge wall of text), but there's a nice passage where religion is described as little more than a convenient method of social control. You'd probably enjoy that, if not the rest of it (it's the only book that I've ever given up on).

Speaking for myself, I'd never begrudge someone their belief in a soul, afterlife, or creator, as it can be a great comfort in what is otherwise a vast, incomprehensible, and cruel, universe.
( monster munch person, man, woman... camera... TV?, Sun 16 Oct 2011, 21:20, closed)

And neither would I
But I bitterly begrudge the damage organised religion does. More wars are fought over that than anything else. And youre right. It is precisely about social control.
( spimf ™ is whoever you want him to be, Sun 16 Oct 2011, 21:57, closed)

more people
use religeon as an excuse to go to war rather than a cause. Most wars are fought over what they have always been fought about. Resources, land and wealth and who gets to control them.
(andythepieman Is surfing the waves of indifference on, Mon 17 Oct 2011, 10:39, closed)

yes - that is the motivation behind the powers that be
but the easiest way to rally a people behind a cause is to generate a sectarian divide between them and a chosen enemy. ireland during the troubles was a classic example of this - grass roots supporters saw their political divide easily identified by flags and religion, however the higher echelons of the paramilitaries saw there was huge revenue to be gained from rackets, drugs, and prostitution blighting the very communities they were supposed to be defending. it is for this reason the peace process was derailed so often. peace provides no profit for paramilitaries.

and what about jihad - that knows no boundaries, that is about global islamic conversion, if force by necessary.

governments simply use religion as a tool to manipulate the people. kuwait and iraq was about oil, but americans thought it was about freedom, the american way and the fear of the man in the beard and robes - quite happy to stay pals with Saudi though, the nation who provided most of the 9,11 operatives. most US citizens believe theirs is a christian nation. but the very founding principals of america is that is a secular, not a christian nation. however however all politicians know very well atheists don't get elected.

as the man said - imagine no religion
( spimf ™ is whoever you want him to be, Mon 17 Oct 2011, 12:17, closed)