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# Hahahaha
Am I the only one who thinks it's very convenient that Obama's gran has died on the eve of the election?
(I helped save b3ta! Je suis un vagabond is an unfunny, up your own arse middle class knob, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:28, archived)
# Nope, same here
(Mrs Trellis GIN, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:29, archived)
# Is the election still going?
Can't they just fuck off already?
(I helped save b3ta! Mu Dinofiddler, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:31, archived)
# ^ That
(I helped save b3ta! Mr Gear the gay-maker, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:48, archived)
# And you see the arguements breaking out? Down there \/ somewhere.
That's why they should all fuck off.
(I helped save b3ta! Mu Dinofiddler, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:48, archived)
# very convenient.
(k3b/-\b Peace man., Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:31, archived)
# not so convenient for her...
but yeah - as far as timing goes it's suspicious...
(I helped save b3ta! Prof UnderCover evitable, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:34, archived)
# she probably snuffed it a few days ago.
(k3b/-\b Peace man., Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:37, archived)
# it's a hard man who hears his gran is dead and goes:
"... ACE! keep it quiet for a few days!"

... although he's probably surrounded by people who would make the decision for him... so you're probably right.
(I helped save b3ta! Prof UnderCover evitable, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:39, archived)
# it's an optimal decision
(k3b/-\b Peace man., Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:40, archived)
# OR
you're all far too cynical for your own good and there's a man out there who's just got to soldier on.

I don't know either way, but I'd give him the benefit of the doubt rather than immediately jump to the worse of the conclusions.

I know, right? Fuck off back to my camper van, Fae Lennon.
(I helped save b3ta! Captain Wow currently being a cunt in Infamous, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:41, archived)
# He's a politician.
He's self-serving, lying scum who prays on the people in order to line his own pockets.

His gran is but a tool to him.
(I helped save b3ta! Je suis un vagabond is an unfunny, up your own arse middle class knob, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:43, archived)
# this seems a bit extreme.
(I helped save b3ta! Just Flange, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:44, archived)
# Alright, prove it.
I need a little more than a sweeping generalisation to make me believe the worst of someone I barely know.

(see also: all jews are money hungry rats, all black people aren't really human and make lovely help, all Mexican people wear ponchos)
(I helped save b3ta! Captain Wow currently being a cunt in Infamous, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:46, archived)
# politicians tend to prove themselves. think of the former prime ministers of the uk
(k3b/-\b Peace man., Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:49, archived)
# Yes, but he hasn't proved himself to be a git yet
so let him do that before accusing him of being one.
(I helped save b3ta! Captain Wow currently being a cunt in Infamous, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:50, archived)
# is there not a reasonable probability of him being a git?
like a majority of the politicians before him?
(k3b/-\b Peace man., Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:51, archived)
# So that's license to prejudge?
Because other people have proven themselves to be morally inept there's absolutely no way that he could be any different?

I'm perfectly happy to accept differing opinions here. I suppose I'm just looking on the bright side until given a reason not to. God knows there's enough stuff in the world to depress myself about, I'm not going to waste the one life I've got thinking everything's going to turn out shit if there's a bit of hope. If I did that I'd probably end up lobbing myself off something quite high up. Naive? Yes. But I'm stressed enough.
(I helped save b3ta! Captain Wow currently being a cunt in Infamous, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:55, archived)
# It's not prejudice, I haven't outright said he's a lair/powergrubber
I'm simply muting the possibility of it. And my probabilistic arguments leave the possibility that he is not a git open.
(k3b/-\b Peace man., Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:58, archived)
# No I know, I'm just discussing it.
I'm not just talking about your views, but yours and vagabonds, and whoever else wants to discuss it.

Edit: I can see this is not a day for me to be perched atop the board. Bye bye peeplings, see you on a calmer day.
(I helped save b3ta! Captain Wow currently being a cunt in Infamous, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:59, archived)
# ah but vagabond's trolling to be annoying.
i'm being sort of reasonable...
(k3b/-\b Peace man., Tue 4 Nov 2008, 10:01, archived)
# I honestly can't tell anymore.
I've discussed it too much, I think. Bye bye Kebs.
(I helped save b3ta! Captain Wow currently being a cunt in Infamous, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 10:03, archived)
# No.
Wrong.

He's a politician. All politicians are liars.
(I helped save b3ta! Je suis un vagabond is an unfunny, up your own arse middle class knob, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:51, archived)
# It must be so nice to live in a state of such certainty.
(I helped save b3ta! J Peasemould Gruntfuttock Alpha Mike Foxtrot, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 10:24, archived)
# haha says the aussie ;)
but seriously, you're right there, everyone's wrapped up in the idea that Obama isn't Mccain/Palin and that he is black, but no-one really seems to gather what he ACTUALLY is. i reckon he's gonna win, but i also reckon once he's in he'll fall to pieces (if he isn't killed).
(I helped save b3ta! Just Flange, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:52, archived)
# I was reading a pretty good article the other day saying that anyone who votes
for Obama because he's black is just as bad as anyone who doesn't vote for him because he's black...
(I helped save b3ta! Prof UnderCover evitable, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:55, archived)
# totally agree and could say more on the subject except that i promised myself less b3ta time.
(I helped save b3ta! Just Flange, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:57, archived)
# I can name a heap of aussie pollies that are lying manipulative bastards
just that most people (in the discussion) would be unfamiliar with their exploits.

*polishes shackles*
(k3b/-\b Peace man., Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:56, archived)
# no need, no need. i'm just fuckin with ya.
i totally agree, our loliticians are just as shit as many others.

I hold out hope for an america under a different type of rule, but i think it's naive to believe in Obama as the single catalyst for change in a nation that's so badly fucked.
(I helped save b3ta! Just Flange, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:59, archived)
# This is absolutely nothing to do with his colour, or religion, or sex, or orientation, or anything other than .
him deliberately seeking a position of extreme power.

I trust no one that seeks power and am immediately cynical about their motives.
(I helped save b3ta! Je suis un vagabond is an unfunny, up your own arse middle class knob, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:51, archived)
# that's a very dull view. how would you prefer it?
some nobody gets power thrust upon him purely because he doesn't want it?

of course he wants power but that's no reason to be cynical, i do agree with the view that a lot of people seeking power are doing so for the wrong reasons, but sometimes you have to suspend dis-believe to allow for hope, otherwise what's the point of participating in society? you might as well become a hermit, only then you'll still be subject to the laws, but with no way of affecting change in them.
(I helped save b3ta! Just Flange, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:55, archived)
# Admittedly I do have a rather dim view of humanity.
(I helped save b3ta! Je suis un vagabond is an unfunny, up your own arse middle class knob, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:56, archived)
# I agree that people are capabale of despicable and disgusting things
and the people most likely to commit these despicable and disgusting acts are people in power ... I just don't feel that one follows directly from the other and that using the death of a beloved relative for political gain is low even by the low moral standards of the political classes.
(I helped save b3ta! Prof UnderCover evitable, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 10:01, archived)
# He's already ahead in the polls by 10%, now he's going after an extra 0.5% with a risk of a massive backlash?
He's been smart up until now and he has no need to get that desparate.

But yes, I just finished watchin firth goes to washington and it was fucking great.
(I helped save b3ta! gronkpan @vomitinglarry.bsky.social, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 10:34, archived)
# we're just being childish
I don't think anyone legitimately believes that the death of a beloved Grandmother is something anyone would use for political gain, even if they are a politician... very sorry - I forgot about Vagabond.

I don't think anyone who isn't filled with the elemental darkness legitimately believes the death etc etc etc
(I helped save b3ta! Prof UnderCover evitable, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:45, archived)
# *points up* really?
(I helped save b3ta! Captain Wow currently being a cunt in Infamous, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:46, archived)
# amended
(I helped save b3ta! Prof UnderCover evitable, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:49, archived)
# I'm not.
although it's just a possibility, and I know he's probably upset about it. But bloody fantastic timing for the sympathy vote.
(k3b/-\b Peace man., Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:47, archived)
# it leaves a very sour taste in my mouth...
also - for all the people who feel sympathy because of it, I think the timing causes a proportion (although I'll admit probably a smaller proportion) to be cynical of it.
(I helped save b3ta! Prof UnderCover evitable, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:52, archived)
# but those that are cynical of it were probably already decided voters.
(k3b/-\b Peace man., Tue 4 Nov 2008, 10:03, archived)
# me? cynical?
(k3b/-\b Peace man., Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:46, archived)
# Won't make any difference
as sad as it is, I feel McCain is going to win
(I helped save b3ta! Joe Scaramanga with a G-double-O-D vibration, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:37, archived)
# hum that would be a massive massive upset.
(k3b/-\b Peace man., Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:37, archived)
# It will be funny to watch all the hippies crying, though.
(I helped save b3ta! Je suis un vagabond is an unfunny, up your own arse middle class knob, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:40, archived)
# ha ha ha
yeah - that would be funny
(I helped save b3ta! Prof UnderCover evitable, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:42, archived)
# I'm not sure he'll win
but he's not as dead in the water as he's trying to make out.

I think they pump something into the booths because a lot of people turn republican at the moment they vote.
(I helped save b3ta! Prof UnderCover evitable, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:40, archived)
# either that or people enjoy looking broadminded and open when questioned and therefore pledge allegiance to the black man that's gonna "change america" for the better,
but when it comes down to it, they're close minded and scared of change.
(I helped save b3ta! Just Flange, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:43, archived)
# I can dig this
but it strikes me that they Republicans have made such a HUGE fuck up of EVERYTHING that you would have to be exceedingly short sighted to think "well - at least they not black and they're pro life and ... blah blah blah"

I suppose we'll find out. Like I say - I think it will be close.
(I helped save b3ta! Prof UnderCover evitable, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:48, archived)
# Exactly my thoughts...
(I helped save b3ta! Joe Scaramanga with a G-double-O-D vibration, Tue 4 Nov 2008, 9:58, archived)