Brilliantly edited film about the occupy wall street protest
Ronseal
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TownsendsPublisher is all gravy baby, Mon 17 Oct 2011, 7:54,
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although
i'd say it was primarily about the hypocracy of Government
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strictlyrockers hasnt been on here for ages, Mon 17 Oct 2011, 8:23,
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it's about a lot of things. Virtually everyone in attendance has their own specific reasons.
What they have in common is that they are disillusioned with mainstream politics and see the financial class as being responsible for the current economic crisis.
Primarily though OWS functions as a form of reclaimed public space, where people are engaging in communicative politics (in the true, communal and participatory sense of the word) outside of the control and mediation of the mainstream (corporate) media or their corrupted political parties. In a sense it is more a moral conversation than anything else - the people there seem to be establishing a general ideological framework rather than calling for any one policy.
The danger to this movement comes from both the traditional Left and the Right. Communists and Libertarians, Republicans and Democrats, all will want to hitch these people to their outdated and irrelevant belief-wagons. It's the same here in the UK with the OLSX camp - Labour (corporate fauxcialist stooges that they are) will desperately want to absorb the movement and unwittingly neutralise it on behalf of the political (ruling) class.
(, Mon 17 Oct 2011, 10:05, Reply)
A link to a page containing an embedded youtube video
A/C
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mr.dogshit The world's premier anthropomorphic canine faeces, Mon 17 Oct 2011, 8:43,
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Didn't most of the people in New York get arrested because they tried to block the roads?
I found it a bit uncomfortable how the new york protesters were being comnpared to protesters in Tehran, Syria and Libia.
As far as I know Obama was not having protestors shot by snipers, there hadn't been decades of instances of people having nails torn out, electrodes on the testicles, people being "disappeared" and their familiers threatened. Women in America have the vote and are not sentenced to death for adultery, their not locked up for wanting the same rights as men.
Yes pepper spray is nasty but get a little perspective.
Sorry to rant but aside from "Black Flag" which are another case all I am seeing in these protests are a bunch of people who had it rather well over the past decade whilst the rest of the world suffered and now the bills need paying are starting to feel aggrieved.
If they were protesting against capitalism whilst they were doing well under it i'ld have a bit more respect.
Hell, if they even had a clear list of demands i'ld have more respect.
It just seems to be a vague "rich people are bad" sentiment without a clear message on how they're going to change things.
The people behind these protests know that if they were to go into specifics support will fragment.
Also I would be very careful before throwing my support behind anonymous. At best they're a bunch of script kiddies that have a taste for your credit card details and a sideline in corporate espionage.
Or at worst they're a puppet organisation under the control of one the brutal regimes that are currently engaged in cyber warfare. I notice in their campaign they not attached Russian, Chinese or North Korean interests.
And if I see one more bloody Guy Fawkes mask....
End of rant.
*goes off to get coffee and kick puppies*
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Cerebus Sticky! Sticky! Stick! Stick!, Mon 17 Oct 2011, 8:57,
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yes theres valid points here
context etc but the main point is double-speak of Govt.
the self-styled "democracy" are quite the opposite;i work at a port in the UK and the international crews love the courtesy that we show them as opposed to their treatment in US ports. They are routinely searched offshore at gunpoint;they are not allowed to set foot even on the jetty they land at;they are not allowed hospital visits;they are not allowed fresh water deliveries;they are allowed food or other ships'stores deliveries.
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strictlyrockers hasnt been on here for ages, Mon 17 Oct 2011, 9:10,
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Democracy doesn't mean "nice guys" though it just means you get to choose your leadership.
American border controls have always been a bugger to non U.S citizens.
A country can be absolute cunts to the rest of the world as (america has at times) and still be called democratic if said people acting like cunts were elected.
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Cerebus Sticky! Sticky! Stick! Stick!, Mon 17 Oct 2011, 9:22,
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ive been to the US a few times
pre-9/11 admittedly,but never had any bother
Cunts?yes they are....those in power anyway
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strictlyrockers hasnt been on here for ages, Mon 17 Oct 2011, 9:31,
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If by "choose your leadership" you mean pick one of a narrow selection of rich fellas who all broadly share the same ideology (neoliberalism) and are unduly influenced by corporate money
then yes, Britain and America are democracies.
That's not my definition of democracy, but hey - whatever floats your vote.
(, Mon 17 Oct 2011, 9:51, Reply)
I wouldn't lump American and British democracies in the shame boat.
In the UK you have 3 main parties plus numerous smaller ones that cover the traditional political spectrum from left to right.
But if none of those parties fits your ideology you can easily run as an independent.
www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2009/may/22/how-to-become-an-mp
Ok you'll have to find 10 people to support you and if you poll less than 5% you'll lose your £500 deposit but it's hardly american levels of money.
British politics is not perfect but it's a damn site better and less corrupt than american politics.
Don't lump them in together. Aside from a common language America and the UK are vastly different countries.
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Cerebus Sticky! Sticky! Stick! Stick!, Mon 17 Oct 2011, 11:44,
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well no they aren't the same, but the point about the 3 main parties sharing one general belief system stands.
Also: liberalconspiracy.org/2010/05/13/an-illustration-of-private-school-intake-of-the-new-cabinet/
The above doesn't look particularly good, but is unsurprising for the Tories I suppose. Below is a few links about party funding now that mass membership has collapsed over the last 20 years. Theoretically you are correct about anyone being an MP but I can't see how you can compete with the media exposure the Big Three possess. Edit: just remembered that one Independent did get elected a few years ago, so well done to him.
www.opendemocracy.net/ourkingdom/stuart-weir/uk-party-funding-bite-bullet-or-remain-biased
blogs.lse.ac.uk/politicsandpolicy/2010/11/26/party-funding-reforms-are-overdue-in-the-uk-but-they-should-not-be-rushed/
NuLabour had 13 years and an unprecedented electoral mandate - yet during this time they kowtowed to the likes of NewsCorp and presided over a growth in inequality unseen since the Edwardian period as well as the deregulation of finance. Red, blue or yellow, big business wins.
But you are absolutely correct about us not being America.
Henceforth I promise not to talk party politics here. We come to /links for funtiemz not to be reminded of all this shit. Promise.
(, Mon 17 Oct 2011, 12:26, Reply)
I think this is basically most non-merkin's criticism of their ways isn't it
freedom and democracy for all so long as you're a white merkin and do everything you're told, beyond that you're scum and may be shot.
That and their insistance on policing the planet to their rules and 'liberating' you whether you want it or not.
As an example Visa are currently having a hissy fit over their cards being used to purchase legal highs over here which are illegal where they're based in California, and refusing to allow their UK card users and our government to choose for themselves what we can spend our own money on, Paypal have done the same and Alertpay are being forced by the card companies to withdraw too, strangely I don't feel I need their 'guidance' on these matters when it's based purely on their own moral laws over there, I think I and my government should be able to make such decisions ourselves and I certainly don't think it's up to some big dollar obsessed posturing merkin company to make that decision for me, but there you go, that's typical, its wrong for them so it's wrong for all, or else.
Twats.
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..wil, Mon 17 Oct 2011, 9:44,
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My guess is that they could be prosecuted if they break U.S laws abroad.
Being a credit card they're actually the ones making the purchase not you.
I know here if a citizen breaks the law of the U.K even if it's abroad and legal in that country they could be prosecuted. So maybe there's something similar happening here.
On a side note, be careful with the ol' ethno botanicals mate. You sound like you are but you need to do your research on them before taking. Some are great, but you get others like Salvia then can really screw you up.
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Cerebus Sticky! Sticky! Stick! Stick!, Mon 17 Oct 2011, 11:51,
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Previously, when it's got a bit 'political' on here (a good thing) I've not agreed with your postings at all.
Here, however (for me) you've hit the nail squarely on the head.
Last week in a news report, I saw a protester in Wall St compare himself the protesters in Syria, Libya, Tehran &c. : I actually physically winced.
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Tab Hunter Make this useless process end and so, begin again, Mon 17 Oct 2011, 9:49,
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I find my politics doesn't gell well with others most times.
Some subjects I can be very left wing and some right wing.
In this regard i'ld be a supporter of the Lib Dems if they weren't a lying shower of shit.
I'm just grateful at the lack of Che Guevara t-shirts in these protests....
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Cerebus Sticky! Sticky! Stick! Stick!, Mon 17 Oct 2011, 13:07,
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Same here.... I like to think of myself as a wooly-leftie, but it often scares me how close my politics marry with the tories.
Our (liberal) MP is a lovely chap (& friend of my partner) but has been forced into massaging facts, vocally supporting stuff I know he doesn't & generally justifying Clegg & Co's behaviour. Shameful.
And regardless of how much good he's done locally, I now can't vote for him, were he to run again....
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Tab Hunter Make this useless process end and so, begin again, Mon 17 Oct 2011, 13:49,
Reply)
sorry but...
dont we the 99percent
really really really want to be the 1 percent?
i thought that was the point of it all?
(checks rules)
(, Mon 17 Oct 2011, 11:46, Reply)
I think you've got that wrong....
The 99% want what the 1% have shared equally between the %99 so the %100 will be 0.001% better off and rather glad that as a world population they're in the 5% that's doing rather better than the 95% .
*some of these figures may have been pulled out of my arse*
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Cerebus Sticky! Sticky! Stick! Stick!, Mon 17 Oct 2011, 11:55,
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You're both wrong.
It's rather that the 99% would be a lot happier if there were no 1%, regardless of how their personal wealth would change.
(, Mon 17 Oct 2011, 13:04, Reply)
no thats idealistic...
this is not people saying "the super rich are fucking the earth and society...being rich is really bad mkay"
its people thinking
"i want to be super rich but i'm not... and those fuckers are"
are you seriously trying to argue that people would trade all their shiny conveniences, and their dreams of being rich for a world everyone was HAPPY?
are you new?
(, Mon 17 Oct 2011, 13:21, Reply)
I'm arguing it's envy. Just the same as you.
If there were no people richer than them they wouldn't even notice that they're the '99%'. Any change of their own wealth or standard of living is irrelevant.
(, Mon 17 Oct 2011, 13:29, Reply)
oh sorry
i have a habit of assuming that people only post to call me an idiot.
but i feel like an idiot now
AAHHHHHH
its true...im an idiot.
(, Mon 17 Oct 2011, 13:36, Reply)
As I am supposedly part of this %99 I feel like my voice isn't being heard
Now let's work this out.... there's currently 61,838,154 people in the UK.
So the 1% controlling the nations wealth, power and media numbers 618,381. Those un democratic bastards!
That leaves 61,219,733 people being oppressed by the %1ers that need a voice via a protest movement to speak for them.
According to the BBC there's 2000 to 3000 people at the occupy london protests.
No assuming the higher figure that all the protesters are from the %99 camp as turkeys don't vote for Christmas that means to battle the evil %1ers who are controlling the %99ers have the %0.005ers to speak on their behalf.
As far as I can see %99 of the population isn't protesting at all so we have no means to gauge what they would want. Some may as you say be happy for the %1 of the population to just vanish. Not sure how this could be achieved. Maybe some kind of ebola infected after 8 mints?
Whilst others may just wish to redress the balance a tad but accept that in society some will do better than others be it by family connections, nepotism, class bias, skills, intellect or ambition.
Or others may go father and not want a re-balance but to them themselves become part of this elite %1.
Some may I grant you wish for a total leveling of the playing field and redistribute the wealth.
But this has been done before in the former CCCP, China, and North Korea.
The CCCP imploded and became a pseudo-democratic capitalist state. The Chinese are using capitalism as a tool and buying up large parts of Africa whilst keeping their own population under tight control.
North Korea is the only country left still practising these ideals and they need to keep the population very heavily under the states thumb lest they dare say they're not entirely happy starving to death for the glorious leader.
You can re-distribute the wealth all you want but to keep the distribution level and stop the emergence of a wealthy small percentage you have to have some very nasty politics
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Cerebus Sticky! Sticky! Stick! Stick!, Mon 17 Oct 2011, 13:40,
Reply)
psst.
i think we missed the irony in FB post...
but i enjoy your point none the less.
(, Mon 17 Oct 2011, 14:44, Reply)
