Well look
I'll tell you what gets me. Edinburgh has stacks of cycle paths, cycle lanes etc. and on my commute to work I invariably get stuck behind some git on an expensive bike in garish lycra, peddling along 15 yards away from a clearly marked, deserted cycle path.

Sometimes I try to show them the error of their ways, e.g. "look, there's a cycle path."

Usual reply: "fuck off."

Is there some macho alpha male thing about using cycle paths / lanes?
( MisterPunch did it that way on, Mon 6 Sep 2010, 14:35, 1 reply)

No...
Cycle paths are generally full of glass and dog shit.

If I buy a road bike, I use it on the road*
I don't buy a path bike.

Generally, a cyclist is a road user, just the same as a car driver, a horse and cart, or a herse. We should all learn to share, and respect each other's rights. I don't run red lights, but I see many motorists with hands cupped to ears using mobile phones. They are all crimes that make my blood boil regardless of which tribe a belong to.


*as aoposed to a mountain bike which is for putting in the garage to collect dust.
( Piper Alpha is being a grumpy northerm bastard on:, Mon 6 Sep 2010, 14:47, closed)

without proper safety gear you're nothing but a menace
also if i hit you and it dents the fuck out of my bonnet, who is your insurer?

how much tax do bike users pay? none? get off my road


:-D
(Monkeystrumpet monkey. Monkey, MONKEY!!!, Mon 6 Sep 2010, 14:59, closed)

Oh, ok then.
1. Without proper safety gear they are nothing but a menace TO THEMSELVES. The helmet is not to protect the people they hit.
2. If you hit a cyclist fast enough to "dent the fuck out of" your bonnet, it's probably your fault - your insurance will cover you, unless your third or 3FT only. Their insurer is irrelevant in that case. If they hit you that fast on the other hand, feel free to send them an invoice, if they're still alive. bonnet will probably knock back out again pretty cheap though.
3. As much income tax as you, as much VAT as you and as much council tax as you, probably. Your road tax doesn't even begin to cover the full costs of the road, and your car is wearing them out much much faster than their tiny bike tyres anyway. You should be giving them money, overall.

Complain about the needless lycra instead. That truly is a menace.
(sabre-tooth monkey, Mon 6 Sep 2010, 15:22, closed)

you're a menace....
ok what if something happens to one of the idiots tootling along a 50mph road with no safety gear, or they fall and get hit = they will most likely die. All i suggest is that if you want to be taken seriously on the roads, wear protective gear or ride on the pavement like little girls.

1. if you're not wearing a helmet, you're not intellegent enough to be taken seriously

2. if a cyclist hits me, im just wondering why I should have to shell out?

3. i pay road tax because I have a car. I think this should be the case for any roadgoing vehicle, is that unfair?


p.s are you a cyclist?
(Monkeystrumpet monkey. Monkey, MONKEY!!!, Mon 6 Sep 2010, 15:42, closed)

Respect
If you want to use the road.

1:-Pay road tax
2:- pay insurance
3:- Register your bike so that when you do inevitably break the law the rozzers can track you down.
(andythepieman Is surfing the waves of indifference on, Mon 6 Sep 2010, 16:44, closed)

1. No such thing as road tax.
2. Most decent contents insurance policies cover you whilst out on your bike.
(Vigilante Man weeps because you're stupid., Tue 7 Sep 2010, 0:51, closed)

Number 3
No answer to that one then?
(andythepieman Is surfing the waves of indifference on, Tue 7 Sep 2010, 12:20, closed)

Just getting into it - I'm a novice cyclist (the most dangerous type maybe?).

I like the idea of 3rd party insurance for cyclists. It would be cheap, as they're unlikely to cause massive motorway pileups, or write off your car. I don't reckon you've been rammed by many cyclists though. If it's happening a lot, there's a chance the blame is not 100% with the cyclists. Ask some other car drivers how often it happens to them.

There is no logic in the tax system that suggests you should have to pay directly for services you are using (sadly). I pay tax that goes towards schools, but I have no children, for example. I would happily pay road tax if I could reduce my other taxes for things I did not use. Plus "classic" cars (25 years old or older) are exempt from road tax. Horses are exempt from road tax. Pedestrians do not pay pavement tax or crossing tax. And smaller cars pay less road tax (and larger vehicles more). Perhaps bikes should pay per kilogram (with some sort of reduction for the lack of emissions, like hybrids and electric cars)? I would subscribe to that (as long as I get my schools money back). Write to your MP.

And I wear a helmet. I'm probably still not intelligent enough to be taken seriously though, as I am still on a bicycle (from time to time - not now), and not smart enough to stop replying when weight of opinion is against me.
(sabre-tooth monkey, Mon 6 Sep 2010, 17:02, closed)

There's a reason for that.
It's not road tax. It's vehicle excise duty, and it is a tax purely on owning a car. Much like a tax on buying beer doesn't pay for pubs, it doesn't pay for roads, so that argument is unfortunately spurious.

However, the insurance one is totally valid, and it used to piss me off a fucking treat that probably only about 5% of cyclists have the nous to realise they should have 3rd party insurance at the very least.

The "ah well if I'm in accident it'll be the driver's fault or I won't cause much damage" is exactly the kind of idiotry which should result in cyclists being banned from roads. I fully support cyclists having as much right as cars to be on the roads. If they play by the rules of the roads. Obey all laws, get insured, respect other road users. Just because some car drivers are cunts doesn't give cyclists carte blanche to break the rules. Just as some cyclists being cunts doesn't give drivers the right to tag all cyclists as arseholes.
( the mighty badger Aphrodite, on a bar stool, by your side, Mon 6 Sep 2010, 17:19, closed)

Didn't actually know insurance was available to cyclists (but of course it must be).
I will investigate.
(sabre-tooth monkey, Tue 7 Sep 2010, 10:46, closed)

im not just on the case of badmouthing cyclists
Just the ones who ignore their own safety, riding along 70mph duel carriageways is not clever at all. I have nothing but respect though for ones who use roads about town and have all the correct gear on. I overtake when i can, and usually leave space for them to pass if im in traffic/at a junction.

All I'm suggesting is that if there are stricter laws, cyclists would be safer. Ive never been hit by a bike and i hope it never happens, just IF it did I wouldnt want to have to shell out respraying a scratch or whatever. I have the same opinion for uninsured drivers; they are the scum of the earth though, cyclists are perhaps just a little naive?

I like your take on the tax system, but also get badgers post above regarding "vehicle tax not road tax". I would have thought in this new Green era Classic Cars should pay much much more tax, as they are much more likely to pollute than my 15yo celica....? but i digress :-)


kudos on being a half decent cyclist ;-)
(Monkeystrumpet monkey. Monkey, MONKEY!!!, Tue 7 Sep 2010, 11:33, closed)

Wow - didn't spot that...
If I get hit square on by a car moving at 50mph, and I'm wearing a helmet, it's not going to help me. It's only going to mean I end up more aware of the pain as the life ebbs from me.

Irrelevant to the other issues though. I'll still wear it, so I'm safer when I accidentally hit a child while running a red light or riding on the pavement like a little girl.
(sabre-tooth monkey, Mon 6 Sep 2010, 17:05, closed)

Don't necessarily agree but...
...I like your style.
( number5 has been fighting tramps and losing., Mon 6 Sep 2010, 17:11, closed)

Yes, sort of but no...
Per no. 2 - The insurance may well cover it but who is going to get shafted for the inevitable excess cost and potential future impact of loss of no claims. Would it not be the driver?
( number5 has been fighting tramps and losing., Mon 6 Sep 2010, 17:08, closed)

Listen muppet...
British Cycling is my insurer, and also the Cycling Touring Club insure me as a coach and instructor.
How much tax...? I earn enough to have a couple of bikes valued at probably more than your car. I think I would pay significantly more tax than you.

So... get of my road
( Piper Alpha is being a grumpy northerm bastard on:, Tue 7 Sep 2010, 12:14, closed)