civilised Argies?
news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/8221599.stm

what say we all on this? as someone who has in past had a *cough* vested interest in things remaining illegal, and someone who has a *cough, splutter* bit of a 'problem' with caning it too much I'm still on the side of personal choice...
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 26 Aug 2009, 9:57, 27 replies, latest was 16 years ago)

The Argentine court ruled that: "Each adult is free to make lifestyle decisions without the intervention of the state."
This is the attitude that I like
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Wed 26 Aug 2009, 10:00, Reply)

Quite so
How utterly reasonable. Treat adults as adults and let them make their own choices - even if they're mistakes in some instances.

Why can't we be this sensible over here?
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 26 Aug 2009, 10:07, Reply)

it would be a refreshing attitude

( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Wed 26 Aug 2009, 10:09, Reply)

I'm all for complete decriminilisation of all recreational drugs.

(PsychoChomp, Wed 26 Aug 2009, 10:12, Reply)

I find it impossible to tell if you are serious
on any matter
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Wed 26 Aug 2009, 10:13, Reply)

I am serious on that issue.
Drug use on it's own shouldn't be a crime,
crime caused by drug use should still be tackled.
(PsychoChomp, Wed 26 Aug 2009, 10:20, Reply)

Series 4 of The Wire
That's how it should be!
( whenanimalsattackhumans clad in global hypercolour, Wed 26 Aug 2009, 10:19, Reply)

I'm with you on this.
Criminalisation turns what is essentially a health problem into a social problem. It forces up the street price, which causes more crime, and it forces down the growers' price, which perpetuates poverty. (Think Afghanistan or Colombia would be in quite such a mess if the biggest cash crops there were legal?) It forces down the quality, which means that users (especially of the powdery drugs) never quite know what they're getting.

I don't have any time at all for recreational drugs; it'd be a good thing if they were used a lot less. But they're generally not nearly as harmful as they're made out to be, and can be safer yet. And for those who have a real drug problem, you'd help them better by not making them de facto criminals.
( Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Wed 26 Aug 2009, 11:33, Reply)

My take on this is simple...
...any government that tries to restrict the sale / consumption of certain mind-altering substances, but legalises and profits from the sales of alcohol and nicotine - which are in my mind responsible for more deaths and personal tragedies than all illegal drugs combined - is merely a drug dealer trying to protect its turf.
( I_Was_Mordred, Wed 26 Aug 2009, 10:18, Reply)

Yes.
This.
(berk, Wed 26 Aug 2009, 10:21, Reply)

Yup
There was a woman on BBC Breakfast yesterday going on about how her daughter died from a "legal high" drug after taking alcohol as well.

Apparently there had been 10-20 deaths *ever* linked with the drug.

And I was all like WTF? How many thousands of cases a YEAR are linked with Alcohol and Nicotine? If people are stupid enough to take such substances, then let them. If they're caught damaging property or endangering others in the process, THEN hit them with all sorts of years in prison.
( whenanimalsattackhumans clad in global hypercolour, Wed 26 Aug 2009, 10:22, Reply)

That particularly
irked me as well. Bereaved parents shrieking blue murder because their little darling has chugged a load of stuff thats disagreed with them and died, and suddenly it's the states fault for not outlawing it. It doesn't change the fact that your kid chose to take the drugs though, does it?
(berk, Wed 26 Aug 2009, 10:34, Reply)

The woman was also saying,
"My daughter was a Grade A student, looking to go on to Uni (yadda yadda), who would NEVER have taken something if she knew it was dangerous..."

Well hello there deary but your precious daughter snorted an unknown white powder with intentions of getting high. It doesn't take a genius to work out that she couldn't have been sure it was safe...
( whenanimalsattackhumans clad in global hypercolour, Wed 26 Aug 2009, 10:40, Reply)

they are all always grade A students
just goes to show how standards have definitely slipped
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Wed 26 Aug 2009, 10:53, Reply)

In the words of the late, great Bill Hicks
"Here is my final point. About drugs, about alcohol, about pornography and smoking and everything else. What business is it of yours what I do, read, buy, see, say, think, who I fuck, what I take into my body - as long as I do not harm another human being on this planet?"

And other such things. I maintain that alcohol is much more harmful than a large proportion of the drugs that are illegal in this country, and that's more freely available than ever. Making drugs illegal doesn't work; people take them anyway, so you may as well educate people as to the risks and make the whole lot legal and taxable. I doubt it'll ever happen in this country though.
(berk, Wed 26 Aug 2009, 10:21, Reply)

Bill Hicks
made some excellent points, but never actually made me laugh.

Kind of like a top-end Mark Thomas.

I am aware that this makes me a heretic and I should be burned, but I remember watching a routine of his and thinking 'great bloke...but not actually laugh-out-loud funny....'
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 26 Aug 2009, 10:25, Reply)

Well
they have reclassified some of those gay 'legal highs'

illegal highs

apparantly the marijuana fascimile, Spice or some other nonsense was reasonably similar. And a lot of what you may buy as 'ecstacy', is more often than not that BZP shite, which up until now was completely legal.

It is only a matter of time before they target the mother of all legal highs, Salvia Divinorum. Which, considering its astonishing effects, may not be a bad thing.
(Cancer Joy was short lived, Wed 26 Aug 2009, 10:44, Reply)

I've never found it did much for me
I've tried that spice stuff, under a different name. It's ok. gives you a buzz, makes you giggle, then gives you a headache.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Wed 26 Aug 2009, 10:53, Reply)

I had a similar story
with Salvia at first. That was until i tried some really potent, well manufactured stuff and the difference was clear. 10 seconds after exhaling and i couldn't remember smoking it, completely discombobulated, like free-falling out of reality. 5 minutes later and you're back, subtly altered, but back nonetheless.
(Cancer Joy was short lived, Wed 26 Aug 2009, 11:13, Reply)

It's not half bad is it?
However DMT wins the day. Mind you I think it's a proper illegal, that one.

Really, really bizarre - you feel completely together despite being fucked out of your tiny mind. And it has a weird taste that will remain with you for ever, a la opium.

Mmmmmmm, opium....
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 26 Aug 2009, 11:18, Reply)

interesting
I shall have to give it a go
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Wed 26 Aug 2009, 11:22, Reply)

it's a component of ayahuasca
Now that is some scary-ass shit.

It's the one thing left to try that I've any interest in.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ayahuasca

Hea.Vee.
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 26 Aug 2009, 11:35, Reply)

oh yes
the chap who gave me the DMT was buying this shit on ebay, and that was how he synthesised his raw DMT.

William Burroughs was a big fan, and i recommend reading his book 'the yage letters'. He claimed it enabled telepathy, and i am not in a position to disagree with his synopsis. Apparantly this shit speaks to you, indigenous tribes have claimed that they owe some of their knowledge of the useful plants around them to Yage. The plants effectively TOLD them the benefits they could provide. Sounds like some fucked up headrush.
(Cancer Joy was short lived, Wed 26 Aug 2009, 11:50, Reply)

all the sites I've looked at relating to this stuff
are chock full of super-heavy warnings about how this is not a recreational high and can seriously blow your head off - all very encouraging.

btw I've not checked out that music link yeat I'm afraid, but i can advise that the 'Tortoise' gig i went to last night was so completely and utter devoid of any merit whatsoever that I left after 3 songs. Total shite - sounded like a bunch of adolescents in a secondary school music room. Their gear conked out after 15 seconds - great soundcheck, cunts...
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 26 Aug 2009, 13:12, Reply)

Didn't Tortoise
used to be good? Nothing a well aimed pint of pish wouldn't sort out.

I recently bought a load of, completely legal, Baby Woodrose seeds from e-bay, they are loaded with LSA, a precursor to LSD, and anything between 5 and 10 of them will result in a pretty strong belt. I got 50 for a tenner. haven't tried them yet though.

I bought them because i have been having trouble locating shrooms, my tried and tested spots have borne no fruit of any note for nearly 3 years. Shrooms are lovely, and free!

Yes, do check the link, the doorway to musical nirvana is ajar ;-)
(Cancer Joy was short lived, Wed 26 Aug 2009, 14:11, Reply)

Yes,
definitely try it, but make sure you have someone to sit with you as it can be profoundly mind altering. Folk get into problems with it because they can't remember smoking it and then get panicky because they don't know why they are feeling they way they do. Fear can stem from thinking that this 'new reality' is the real thing, and that your old, worn-out day to day existence is nothing more than an elaborate illusion. Salvia throws back this illusory curtain and reveals a deeper, infinitely more complex level of existence.

All that excitement from something you can buy in you dinner hour, up the high street.

Ain't tried the DMT, i did get some from a bloke who made it himself, but i haven't had the balls to try it yet. I think it is important to use a proper pipe for it as you can't really let a nekkid flame touch it, apparently. It sounds like Salvia, ON ACID! :)
(Cancer Joy was short lived, Wed 26 Aug 2009, 11:39, Reply)

you'll LOVE it
My mate's filthy bottle-strewn coffee table was transformed into a staggeringly-beautiful glass cathedral at one point, last time I had it.

Magic
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 26 Aug 2009, 11:44, Reply)