My prejudice is distressing
and very hard to eliminate. It has never been turned into discrimination and I would hope it never is, because it would make me a bad person which is something I don't think I am (or rather hope I'm not.)

It's the full hijab. *Not* Islam or Muslims themselves, but the hijab. It makes me feel uncomfortable not to see someones face, to gauge their facial expressions and this is the worst bit of all:

A hijab is not simply a symbol of religious faith. What it says to me is you are dirty. You are unclean for displaying yourself in front of men, for not concealing yourself from their 'lust.' I dislike everything it stands for- the belief that men only want to rape women, that women are responsible for mens sexual behaviour. I hate the double standard, but I also hate myself for knowing that I could never be good friends with someone who genuinely believes that swathing themselves in black cloth to preserve male sexual purity is the right thing to do.

Part of this is overwhelmingly negative experiences. A woman in a hijab once stopped and spat at my feet (I was wearing a knee length skirt and a blouse with high heels), I was told I was a 'devil whore' for kissing my boyfriend in public, and once in a library I was approached by a woman (in full hijab) who started telling me to read the Koran. I've read the Koran and it is alien to my beliefs especially in sexual equality.

So yes, I am prejudiced. I wouldn't deny a job to a woman in full hijab, but I don't think our mindsets would ever allow us to be friends.

And for those of you who call me a racist, the only thing I can do is point out that people of any colour can wear a hijab. It's a religion not a race, and I have no prejudice against headscarves, or traditional clothing. Just the overwhelmingly concealing hijab
( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Mon 5 Apr 2010, 16:24, 20 replies)

I find
them a little unnerving to be honest, especially if you're talking to someone wearing one as its very difficult to read someones expression just by looking at their eyes.
(FootOfTim, Mon 5 Apr 2010, 16:58, closed)

I know a male fetishist who wears a full hijab as a fetish item and has even gone out in public in it

It makes me alternately very suspicious/quite amused when I see one on the streets
(essexfriend, Mon 5 Apr 2010, 17:21, closed)

It does bug me...
But I can't put my finger on it. According to a liberal Muslim whom I'm deeply privileged to know, it is more a cultural rather than religious item, and he doesn't like it either.
( jim_bob can herd cats., Mon 5 Apr 2010, 17:43, closed)

It is not part of any religious text, from what I've heard recently from clerics.
It's a practice that started a fucking long time ago when women were still dowry'd.

Buncha bullshit to force a girl to think they have to wear it today.
(Scritty Bakerman., Mon 5 Apr 2010, 21:13, closed)

as far as im aware
they enter into it voluntarily. well, supposedly so. they're not supposed to be forced into doing it. but then if they don't and they get raped i've also heard that under certain countries' Islamic laws she "brought it on herself" and the men get away with it. maybe i heard wrong, but that was my take on the above.
(zenmeban thinks the weather could be better, Mon 5 Apr 2010, 22:49, closed)

I agree
Would Western governments allow male hijabs? Of coures not, because they're tolerated as part of a culture that oppresses women by, as you say, making them responsible for men's sexual urges.

No society would men let walk about with masks on in public.
(Juan Quar is clinging to her front teeth on, Mon 5 Apr 2010, 18:29, closed)

There used to be a law against it ...
'going out with a blackened face'. Don't know how they prosecute that one today. :)
(Que?, Tue 6 Apr 2010, 8:33, closed)

I agree 100% with this bit:
"A hijab is not simply a symbol of religious faith. What it says to me is you are dirty. You are unclean for displaying yourself in front of men, for not concealing yourself from their 'lust.' I dislike everything it stands for- the belief that men only want to rape women, that women are responsible for mens sexual behaviour. I hate the double standard, but I also hate myself for knowing that I could never be good friends with someone who genuinely believes that swathing themselves in black cloth to preserve male sexual purity is the right thing to do."
(MSB Load universe into cannon. Aim at brain. Fire., Mon 5 Apr 2010, 20:49, closed)

And the prize for biggest load of horseshit goes to...

(rnuk http://flickr.com/rnuk, Tue 6 Apr 2010, 12:09, closed)

got an actual view?
or an alternate explanation?
( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Tue 6 Apr 2010, 12:37, closed)

Yes. My actual view is that MSB is talking utter horseshit.
And I guess you too, as it's a direct quote.
(rnuk http://flickr.com/rnuk, Wed 7 Apr 2010, 12:32, closed)

you haven't
actually given a reason why though.
( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Wed 7 Apr 2010, 15:54, closed)

hijab
nom nom nom, they give me the horn.
(knackerz is skinning up, Tue 6 Apr 2010, 4:23, closed)

I think ...
we shouldn't be embarrassed about how offensive the full face hijab is to us. In the same vein as excessive amounts of exposed female flesh is offensive to them.

The conservative arms of all three monotheistic religions cover a woman's hair; orthodox Jewish women wear wigs, Christian nuns wear a wimple and Muslim women wear a headscarf.

But why remove the face? There is a practical reason for this in a desert culture; it protects you from windblown sand stinging your face. The whole 'preserving my beauty for my husband' thing is a cover for promoting difference over integration.

Also, if you took a photo negative, a full face hijab looks a hell of a lot like a KKK grand wizards outfit.
(Que?, Tue 6 Apr 2010, 8:32, closed)

Maybe

(shinypurplebit booked his tickets (yay) on, Tue 6 Apr 2010, 10:50, closed)

Maybe
some of em are Munters
(shinypurplebit booked his tickets (yay) on, Tue 6 Apr 2010, 10:50, closed)

Appalling
I understand in Judaism and Islam what the burying of the dead within 24 hours is all about - it's about making sure in the heat that they don't start to rot. Equally, wearing the dishdasha, thobe and gutra (white nightdress, headscarf and wrap-around-the-heady-thing) because it's hot and wind can blow sand and gravel in your face.

However ... the abaya, niqab and hijab simply strike me as being methods of subjugating women by making them feel uncomfortable and thus reducing their self-confidence.

Wrong. On so, so many levels, wrong.
(JohntheDane, Tue 6 Apr 2010, 11:26, closed)

True
About the only reason I feel sorry for Jack Straw is the stick he got for saying he thought women wearing veils should remove them when they visit his constituency surgery - not least because he's partially deaf and lipreading them might help him understand what they wanted from him.

Mind you, in most other respects, he's an oily little twunt...
( shinyshinyscalp less a man, more a way of life, Tue 6 Apr 2010, 12:06, closed)

The
Hijab is not really a religious symbol, unlike the turban it's a modern tool to cover a woman up, just in case she looks at a man the wrong way and gets raped. They are banning it in Belgium, if it was purely religious there would be up roar.

However don't think your racist for your views. I wonder if anyone on BT3A actually knows a real bonified Hijab wearer...I had the potential of knowing one but my mate turned all religious a la Cat Stevens when he married his wife (cousin) so never really met her in the end.
(bROKEN aRROW PUA HVI Master, Tue 6 Apr 2010, 17:51, closed)

I was working in Beirut a few years back...
Arriving back at my hotel one fine evening - a little the worse for wear - I pushed the lift button and the doors opened to show me 2 'ninjas' in the full getup* - only the eyes stared out at me.

Panicking slightly, I smiled and muttered "I'll get the next one..."

*Ok, I used a little poetic licence there
( snee held his breath since, Wed 7 Apr 2010, 11:41, closed)