Demoralisation at it's finest

Unemployment? Yeah I've been there - in fact that is where I currently reside, and it is anything but fun. As it stands I am on the verge of eviction, several bailliffs are after me, and at the moment I am struggling to see a way out. Still you are probably all thinking this is my own fault, I'm a workshy, whatever - you'd all be very wrong.

See when I was 16, further education was a luxury for many - yes it may seem very monty python to a lot of you, but honestly there was no way my parents could afford me to do A-levels and then University - not that I begrudge anyone who has been - several years more in a classroom I could not imagine as being an easy ride at all. But that aside, I did a YTS, got taken on for a year until my employers went bust, then found a way into IT as a trainee assistant computer operator - basically a tape and print monkey - it was a start.

Since then I have got my head down, learned what I can, and if the opportunities were not there, I left to another place to find better ones. I contracted for several years as well as built up a plethora of skills in what I do. I have worked in several different countries for some very famous companies, tried to keep abreast of all the new developments, and when I realised that contracting was looking grim in the future, took a permanent job. Sadly the first one didn't work out, but the second was far better, got my stripes and settled in for the long haul. Wonderful little bank, a joy to get to in the morning, and tons of great projects to get my teeth into.

Then along comes a world famous American bank, whose investors greed had put unnatural demands on their own resources, as well as that of their directorship. In a panic, caught short one day they took two loans from us, for what in banking terms are paltry amounts - less than the bonuses of some of their directors the previous years, but their failure 2 days later, combined with the way it rocked the markets, destroyed in days my employer. So I was made redundant.

Since then all I have done is relentlessly apply for jobs - more than 60 in the last 10 weeks, and yet all I have managed to achieve are 2 interviews and one week doing desktop support for less money than the dole. I'd like to know why a lot of my applications simply end up unanswered - Is it my nationality? My age? (just turned 40), my lack of a degree? Seems that everyjob over here, no matter how junior insists you have a bloody degree for it, and as much as I would love to, I can't just up and spend 4 years getting one - eating and paying the rent kind of take priority just now.

Like I said I do not begrudge anyone their education - I just got mine differently, through on the job training and taking relevant work courses. I managed two years part time at college, and do have letters after my name, just not the right ones it seems. I honestly feel discriminated against because of it, and wonder if indeed this is the case. If I knew now I would have wanked sailors for coins at the docks to get through Uni, and maybe now things would be different. So if anyone out there reads this and is considering an early start to their career over an education, or is contemplating dropping out of University, take my advice and seriously think about your options first, for where I am right now is not a place I would wish on anyone.

So by all means enjoy the stories on here, but have a thought for those of us, who not only want to work, but can work, yet are seemingly ignored by the agencies and employers out there - I am sure I am not the only one in that boat on here. But honestly, for all of you, if you get the chance of that little certificate for 4 years of your life, then don't take the risk and go for it - you'll thank me one day.
(Waynster James Joyce is fucking my sister!, Mon 6 Apr 2009, 12:57, 15 replies)

Perhaps...
rather than having a missing degree on your CV, something as a former headhunter I barely looked at, it is the tone and content of the CV that is letting you down.

The work market place out these is slightly pap at the moment, but there are jobs, infact my little brother had a rather nice pay rise and promotion in the same sector as you not 3 weeks ago.

Like all things, get your cv out there and have it picked apart - I am sure there are people you can pay for this type of service, but equally there are people here that I am sure would be happy to take a gander.

Chin chin fella, if all else fails you're not too old to take a change of direction...
(feedingtimeatthezoo day 1 of his bikini diet started, Mon 6 Apr 2009, 13:15, closed)

Thanks for that
Perhaps something I should have added is that during the periods of being unemployed before I took other work - including that of being an IT recruitment consultant as well which I did for a while. I have also recentley had it analysed by a few people "in the know" and come up with a new version but neither versions are proving succesful at the moment (the old one ran to 7 pages, the newer just under 3) but still bulletpointing my personal skills, technical skills and work history as well as training and the like.

Really appreciate the replies though, but its back to the drawing board..
(Waynster James Joyce is fucking my sister!, Mon 6 Apr 2009, 13:25, closed)

7 pages is way too long for a CV.

( idonthaveafunnynickname Drink-Aware? Sure. I'm aware I want another drink., Mon 6 Apr 2009, 15:02, closed)

Further to idonthaveafunnynickname's comment...
...even three pages is too long for a CV. Most people won't look past the first two, and then only if there's something on the first page that grabs the attention. Short and sweet is the order of things, and any more pertinent information can be mentioned in the covering letter.
(ThomsonsPier consumes, Mon 6 Apr 2009, 15:05, closed)

I go with a two-page format
One page is cold, hard, but fairly standard boring factoids, like my contact details, DoB and NI, my school and professional qualifications and accreditations, a super-brief work history (one line per job, date - job title - company), and my referees. This page is just about always the same.

The other page is more about stuff that doesn't go into an at-a-glance table format. There's a paragraph about my current role and responsibilities, and a paragraph or two about my most relevant experience for the sort of job I'm applying for. Finally there's that paragraph where I try to convince them that I am a confident well-rounded person with a healthy range of interests and a positive attitude. Heh.

Each section or paragraph gets a heading and my name and phone number go at the top of each sheet.
( Batsgirl, Tue 7 Apr 2009, 8:39, closed)

Something
"f I knew now I would have wanked sailors for coins at the docks to get through Uni" Is that a blackadder ref?

Hopefully you will find something soon.

StyX
(StyX is staring at you, yes YOU!!!, Mon 6 Apr 2009, 13:20, closed)

Hmmm
I think it may well be, but unless things pick up soon it might have to be a career change !
(Waynster James Joyce is fucking my sister!, Mon 6 Apr 2009, 13:26, closed)

I'd certainly say that the lack of a degree shouldn't be holding you back
it's not particularly hard to get a degree these days, so every fucker has one. Doesn't mean they are any good when they get out into the real world.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 6 Apr 2009, 13:32, closed)

This is the irony, though, isn't it?
When the employer insists that you must have had a university education, but in many of these cases, the Bachelor's Degree in Underwater Basket Weaving isn't worth the paper it's printed on in terms of the skills they might otherwise have gleaned from doing an apprenticeship at the aquatic basket-weavers' centre when they finished school.

Yes, I know it's old-fashioned and contains more than a pinch of intellectual snobbery, but I really object to this government policy of making sure half the population has a degree, regardless of subject or content. It doesn't help anybody, as far as I can see...
(LongJohnBaldry, Mon 6 Apr 2009, 13:50, closed)

It's Your Own Fault
.
Nothing to do with your lack of a degree - it's because you joined the ranks of the great unwashed - the permies.

I've been a contractor for almost all of my working life. In almost every contract I've had I've been offered a full-time post - and turned them all down.

Live free - be a contractor!

I've worked through the 80's and the 90's as a freelancer. In downturns, like this one, companies want people who they can take on for a few months and then drop them if the cash gets tight. With the right skills and the right CV you can coin it during this recession.

Gaz me and we'll talk.

Cheers
( Legless Mister Stabby - shanks for the memory, Mon 6 Apr 2009, 13:52, closed)

Gaz'd!
CYI feller - would appreciate the help!
(Waynster James Joyce is fucking my sister!, Mon 6 Apr 2009, 15:11, closed)

Hmm, things are different over here now, Legless
300 people at a time, you're basically not looking at good numbers.

Trust me, you're better off where you are right now. Over here it is b0rked, big time.
( I_Was_Mordred, Mon 6 Apr 2009, 19:07, closed)

I'm not sure about the advice i'm about to give...but here goes...
If you honestly think it's a lack of university degree that is holding you back, have you considered lying? Degrees are ten a penny nowadays and do they really check anyone? At worst they may want to see a certificate...how good are you at photoshop?

As I said, i'm not sure about this advice but what have you got to lose?
( Colonel Dracula Two manky hookers and a racist dwarf, Mon 6 Apr 2009, 14:34, closed)

I can see you point but
... a major point of my job is to be trustworthy, and doing that is nothing short of fraudulent. I want an employer to trust me from the outset, and getting caught would damage my chances irreplicably

But I have just got wind of a second telephone interview from a job I went to last week, priming for the third with the MD so things are already looking up. Must be the love from those on here at B3TA - wish me luck people!
(Waynster James Joyce is fucking my sister!, Mon 6 Apr 2009, 15:14, closed)

Good luck
Hope you get the job
( Colonel Dracula Two manky hookers and a racist dwarf, Mon 6 Apr 2009, 15:17, closed)