Yeah but it's all computers isn't it.All you've got to do is, like, click and the computer does all the actual work, right?
(,
Sun 20 Jun 2010, 19:30,
archived)
I'm sure I could programme an SEO expert10. REM SEO Expert
20. Make arbitrary HTML tweaks
30. Spam blogs
40. Spam directories
50. GOTO 20
Run
(20. Make arbitrary HTML tweaks
30. Spam blogs
40. Spam directories
50. GOTO 20
Run
monkeon schmonkeon,
Sun 20 Jun 2010, 19:41,
archived)
But they should not exist because,20 should not need doing.
Content, keyword selection and link cultivation, yes. Tweaking your HTML? Perhaps you shouldn't need it tweaking?
/defensive.
(Content, keyword selection and link cultivation, yes. Tweaking your HTML? Perhaps you shouldn't need it tweaking?
/defensive.
LordManley twitter.com/LordManley,
Mon 21 Jun 2010, 15:23,
archived)
Yes, I knowbut his use of 'arbitrary' comes across a bit like 'which I don't understand' which may explain the difference in wages.
I don't actually believe this of monkeon, but I also do not believe that he thinks SEO is unimportant.
(I don't actually believe this of monkeon, but I also do not believe that he thinks SEO is unimportant.
LordManley twitter.com/LordManley,
Tue 22 Jun 2010, 11:09,
archived)
RE: ArbitraryWhen I used to be given changes to make on behalf of an SEO as part of my job, they seem to change about monthly.
As far as I can tell, 90% of the job is link building, so these changes it would appear are only being made either.
1. Because they don't know what they are doing
or
2. They are trying to pretend there is something the client can't do in these tweaks (blinding people witch science), unlike the link building which doesn't *seem* to require qualifications and they could do themselves.
I admit in this case I am basing a practise on the evidence of 1 team, so it's not really an overly valid point.
(As far as I can tell, 90% of the job is link building, so these changes it would appear are only being made either.
1. Because they don't know what they are doing
or
2. They are trying to pretend there is something the client can't do in these tweaks (blinding people witch science), unlike the link building which doesn't *seem* to require qualifications and they could do themselves.
I admit in this case I am basing a practise on the evidence of 1 team, so it's not really an overly valid point.
monkeon schmonkeon,
Tue 22 Jun 2010, 11:31,
archived)
I submit to you that youy may have a shit SEObut at the end of the day I can demonstrate that the work I do produces far more money than it costs, which is why I am worth it.
I stopped being a developer a long time ago and have done pretty much none at all for 3 or 4 years, but I have developers working for me and a very deep and broad knowledge (deep in my discipline and broad in the field - I am a T shapes person!) I really think that I can do a lot of good and I have experience and practice in doing so.
(I stopped being a developer a long time ago and have done pretty much none at all for 3 or 4 years, but I have developers working for me and a very deep and broad knowledge (deep in my discipline and broad in the field - I am a T shapes person!) I really think that I can do a lot of good and I have experience and practice in doing so.
LordManley twitter.com/LordManley,
Tue 22 Jun 2010, 12:07,
archived)
Do you not think that your background in developmentis a strong benefit over your rival SEOs?
Qualifications is one thing that many do not seem to have.
A background in the industry, honing in on the one aspect seems relevant, whereas coming from a sales background does not.
"I can demonstrate that the work I do produces far more money than it costs, which is why I am worth it."
Good point, though do some people not just buy AdWords and when their sales go up, say this is a sign of success? Would you say that is an honest practise?
As an un-argumentative aside, do you not think that link building is a somewhat sisyphean challenge - for as soon as you set them up, google discover them and knock them down.
Would you say a company is better approaching an SEO firm than a Viral Marketing firm to get links? If so, why?
Do you think there is a long future in SEO, or are you just in it while the going's good?
(Qualifications is one thing that many do not seem to have.
A background in the industry, honing in on the one aspect seems relevant, whereas coming from a sales background does not.
"I can demonstrate that the work I do produces far more money than it costs, which is why I am worth it."
Good point, though do some people not just buy AdWords and when their sales go up, say this is a sign of success? Would you say that is an honest practise?
As an un-argumentative aside, do you not think that link building is a somewhat sisyphean challenge - for as soon as you set them up, google discover them and knock them down.
Would you say a company is better approaching an SEO firm than a Viral Marketing firm to get links? If so, why?
Do you think there is a long future in SEO, or are you just in it while the going's good?
monkeon schmonkeon,
Tue 22 Jun 2010, 12:25,
archived)
If I might just answer your last question first,I am a technical consultant - yes I am good, but there are quite a few good SEOs about. Maybe I am in the top 10 in the UK, but then I am SEO Director at the largest digital agency in Europe, so I fucking well ought to be good.
On the flip side of that, there are a lot of shit SEOs and, more importantly, a lot of good PPC chaps, media buyers, affiliates and so on who say they can do SEO in order to land a full service contract, which is what you are probably falling foul of.
AdWords is PPC, not SEO.
Sales people make shit SEOs, but they are good at selling it.
SEO should die - SEO should become part of D&B and not exist as a lone product, but that (and the hiring of shit SEOs) will only happen once marketing managers listen to professionals and stop building flashy poorly coded sites and developers learn to build sites well.
(On the flip side of that, there are a lot of shit SEOs and, more importantly, a lot of good PPC chaps, media buyers, affiliates and so on who say they can do SEO in order to land a full service contract, which is what you are probably falling foul of.
AdWords is PPC, not SEO.
Sales people make shit SEOs, but they are good at selling it.
SEO should die - SEO should become part of D&B and not exist as a lone product, but that (and the hiring of shit SEOs) will only happen once marketing managers listen to professionals and stop building flashy poorly coded sites and developers learn to build sites well.
LordManley twitter.com/LordManley,
Tue 22 Jun 2010, 16:48,
archived)
Fair enough.Could you perhaps explain the difference between a bad SEO and a good SEO and how one would go about telling the difference. What questions should they be asked to prove their skill base?
( monkeon schmonkeon,
Tue 22 Jun 2010, 17:13,
archived)
As an employer of (currently) 23 SEOsNo, haven't got a clue. I take 'em as grads and keep the good ones. Sorry.
( LordManley twitter.com/LordManley,
Tue 22 Jun 2010, 17:13,
archived)
Also,feel free to hire me and my team ;)
( LordManley twitter.com/LordManley,
Tue 22 Jun 2010, 17:22,
archived)
You're beatingRhys and his mystery men (a few posts down) in my opinion, anyway!
( monkeon schmonkeon,
Tue 22 Jun 2010, 17:24,
archived)
Milt comes across as very good to me.I'm really very expensive, so unless you are huge, maybe you should hire him?
That said, if he is as good as he sounds then maybe he is very expensive too?
(That said, if he is as good as he sounds then maybe he is very expensive too?
LordManley twitter.com/LordManley,
Tue 22 Jun 2010, 17:54,
archived)
You must have some wayof differentiating between good and bad?
Do they do more than link building? Do they do proper marketing to get real links to the sites, for example?
(Do they do more than link building? Do they do proper marketing to get real links to the sites, for example?
monkeon schmonkeon,
Tue 22 Jun 2010, 17:23,
archived)
Technical SEO is a skillhow good someone is is borne out from their work, just as being able to code is a very minor part of programming.
Assessing someone's vision and understanding cannot really be done in an interview.
(Assessing someone's vision and understanding cannot really be done in an interview.
LordManley twitter.com/LordManley,
Tue 22 Jun 2010, 17:53,
archived)