Bye bye NHS...
Sorry for posting actual 'news', but the health reform bill has passed through the Lords.
So long free healthcare for all, hello spiralling inequalities!
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barryheadwound Mul-ti-pass? Multipass!, Wed 12 Oct 2011, 15:01,
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More of the same then...
sigh.....
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skeltonator Needs some new daps., Wed 12 Oct 2011, 15:10,
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Um...
Don't want to be contentious, but this isn't a case of going from having something that's super awesome and fair and equitable to something that's evil, unfair and heinous.
It's a slight shift, which means that healthcare provision which already favours the wealthier* might possibly do so a smidgeon more, but that's not really been proved - it's just possible.
*This isn't criticising the current system unduly. You can't really stop rich people buying themselves advantages in health, education etc etc. It's sort of what people want to spend money on if they have it.
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prince-igor si tacuisses, philosophus mansisses, Wed 12 Oct 2011, 15:15,
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It's that opening of the door for private sector providers though...
Experience and hard evidence tells us that this has never resulted in improvements or efficiencies, merely increased amounts of tax revenues going to shareholders rather than public agencies and service users.
It's not that the wealthy will receive a better standard of care, but the standard for those who cannot afford it will go through the floor :o(
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barryheadwound Mul-ti-pass? Multipass!, Wed 12 Oct 2011, 15:36,
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It's opening the door to a growth in the privatised provision of healthcare services.
It also means a vast multiplication of admin, which in turn means a gross increase in waste, which in turn means that the taxpayer loses, which in turn means that the
It's the thin tip of a corporate cock that's about to rip through our collective rectums like wet tissue-paper.
My quality of life is maintained by an expensive medication, so I'm extremely worried about all this. We're only a couple of steps away from having to have health-insurance like the yanks. Insurance that won't cover me (like millions of Americans) due to my "pre-existing condition".
We're turning into a mini-America, so if you've got some decent in-demand qualifications then you'd do well to go somewhere else. I don't, so unless I win the lottery then I'm stuck.
(, Wed 12 Oct 2011, 17:08, Reply)
*despairs
From a purely practical point of view, the NHS is going from being run by 150 bodies (PCTs, SHAs etc.) to over 600 - each of which will need to have contracts and SLAs in place every bit of healthcare provided. McKinsey's and their ilk are already well into the GP commissioning groups offering to 'help' with this.
Throw in GPs deciding which services are no longer covered by the NHS whilst setting up private companies to offer those very same services and primary care is going the way of dentistry. It appears there's feck all anyone can do about it.
Best advice I can think of is "don't be ill"
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TownsendsPublisher is all gravy baby, Wed 12 Oct 2011, 15:20,
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I'm glad I followed through on leaving the country when a tory government was elected.
(, Wed 12 Oct 2011, 15:30, Reply)
In all fairness though they weren't that elected.
Where did you go?
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Cerebus Sticky! Sticky! Stick! Stick!, Wed 12 Oct 2011, 15:37,
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In power is enough for me to leave. I'm in Iceland now, best thing I ever did.
(, Wed 12 Oct 2011, 15:55, Reply)
i was there last week realy nice place clean friendly and
they even carried my bags to the car
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fluffybunnykiller Is feasting on the clitoris of life, Wed 12 Oct 2011, 17:50,
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We've not had a proper public healthcare system for a very long time.
Ever since Bupa and the like got set-up the NHS has gone down hill.
When you've only had one choice for healthcare the rich and powerful made sure it was in a fit state for them to use too.
That and people expecting to live longer, be able to sue when things go wrong and use all the latest drugs and techniques but not pay for them through higher taxes has bleed the NHS of funds.
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Cerebus Sticky! Sticky! Stick! Stick!, Wed 12 Oct 2011, 15:35,
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Out of curiousity,
when does someone become "rich"? What's the threshold for example from just "well off" to "rich" to "elite/powerful/lizard" ?
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JamTallons, Wed 12 Oct 2011, 15:40,
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Well rich relative to others isn't it? In some countries i'ld be considered rich because I own a house.
In others I would be considered just average because of it's size.
And powerful is just that. Someone with power to exert over others.
Lizard? You're in david ike territory there.
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Cerebus Sticky! Sticky! Stick! Stick!, Wed 12 Oct 2011, 15:50,
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It's true! They're responsible for Global Warming, as it enables them to freely move around the planet without the need for
(, Wed 12 Oct 2011, 16:17, Reply)
I know this one...
Earn over £26k, and you're in the richer half.
Or it's £33k if you look at those of employment age only.
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prince-igor si tacuisses, philosophus mansisses, Wed 12 Oct 2011, 16:16,
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Yay! I'm not rich. I was worried for a minute there.
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Cerebus Sticky! Sticky! Stick! Stick!, Wed 12 Oct 2011, 16:43,
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Quit your job and wait...
If you're in trouble within a year then you weren't rich.
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RadioElectric, Wed 12 Oct 2011, 20:55,
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We have a proper
public health care system, and the fact that we have one makes it amazing.. Not for an awful lot longer.
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Herb Alpert's Taxi Driver I have very beautiful lips, Wed 12 Oct 2011, 15:50,
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Well the managers took over, did a crap job and golden handshakes to leave.
The pharmaceutical companies bribed G.Ps with free gifts if they prescribed their products.
Cleaning was passed over from unionised workers to private companies who then sub- contracted.
Matrons with taken off the ward leaving nurses and doctors to try and manage wards themselves.
Catering budgets were slashed meaning people are actually leaving hospital malnourished.
For me the NHS died a long time ago, this is just a shell and people do it no favours pretending that the NHS now is some beacon for healthcare.
The Tories started the rot last time they were in power and Labour finished it off.
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Cerebus Sticky! Sticky! Stick! Stick!, Wed 12 Oct 2011, 15:56,
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Yes
it's much better to pay for private health care. I'm looking forward to the future as a self-employed person finding out how much my private insurance will be. Fuck the shoddy service we get now from the rubbish NHS, let's close it down and give people what they actually want.
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Herb Alpert's Taxi Driver I have very beautiful lips, Wed 12 Oct 2011, 16:17,
Reply)
How's the view from up there?
Why is it when someone doesn't side with one side of an argument they assume that you automatically are pro the other side?
You seem to be under the impression I approve and want an end to to social care.
I don't, but i'm not going to pretend what we've had for the past 20-30 years was a proper social health care system.
Give me the power to change things and i'ld tax the private hospitals to the hilt, not allow G.P's to work for the private sector until they've served a certain amount of years and paid back to the state what the state paid to train them. Make sure private hospitals take care of the patient from start to finish and not do what they do now and skimp on the recuperative care and fob that off on the NHS.
I would also put out of business with punitive fines any company that takes on a NHS contract job and fails in it's care of duty. I would also prosecute with corporate man slaughter any CEO's who's company has caused deaths in this manner.
People who think what we've had is proper social healthcare probably also think the last labour government was a proper labour one and if a few years of having to pay for healthcare is what it takes for people to wake up and demand social healthcare then so be it.
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Cerebus Sticky! Sticky! Stick! Stick!, Wed 12 Oct 2011, 16:35,
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Bollocks
I've had to rely heavily on the NHS since the early 80's and I can assure you that it was awful, and I mean really awful under the tory party and improved immeasurably under Labour by comparison. I think people forget just how bad it used to be. No problem though as in a couple of years time they should get it back to how it was.
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slartifartfast When all around are losing their heads, duck., Wed 12 Oct 2011, 19:36,
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Both my parents have had heart surgery under the NHS and the quality of their care was awesome.
Really nice folks working for the NHS under (I imagine) often difficult circumstances and bureaucracy.
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JamTallons, Wed 12 Oct 2011, 21:39,
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Makes me glad I live in Scotland.
Where we get free prescriptions! I'd have no money if that wasn't the case.
(, Wed 12 Oct 2011, 18:20, Reply)
Moved to Scotland about a year ago.
I've found the NHS in Scotland generally better than back in England, lots more focus on preventative medicine and the like. In general I approve.
(, Wed 12 Oct 2011, 19:06, Reply)