No swimming during Ramadan...
...just incase you swallow water, and break your fast.
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AgeOwns Has just started Geocaching, Mon 12 Jul 2010, 20:56,
Reply)
See, the problem here is the use of the word 'told'.
The document released by the council in question says:
"In general, participation in swimming is an acceptable activity whilst fasting. However, for many pupils this activity may prove to be an issue, as the potential for swallowing water is very high. Some pupils or parents consider the risk too great and may wish to avoid swimming whilst fasting. Others may take the view that as swallowing water is unintentional it does not break the fast.
Schools with a significant number of Muslim pupils should try to avoid scheduling swimming lessons during Ramadan to remove unnecessary barriers to full participation."
The council suggested this as a possibility, for schools with a significant number of Muslim pupils. The word 'told' implies some sort of order, which there wasn't.
Do the media care? Do they fuck. Daily Mail and other shitrags blow this out of proportion to create MUSLIMS! POLITICAL CORRECTNESS GONE MAD! YOU COULDN'T MAKE IT UP! bullshit.
tabloid-watch.blogspot.com/ and the-sun-lies.blogspot.com/ are pretty good for debunking this sort of thing.
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ArthurTheRat, Mon 12 Jul 2010, 20:57,
Reply)
^ clickin dis
Is there a HYS thread on this? I might have a look and see what the usual morons are saying and send something to spEak you're bRanes.
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spesh., Mon 12 Jul 2010, 21:03,
Reply)
Err
If my child was prevented from swimming lessons because of the risk of hurting the sentiments of religious morons who believe in sky fairies, I would be absolutely outraged
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Jahled Three shades of black, Mon 12 Jul 2010, 21:13,
Reply)
Maybe.
But since it's never happened in this country, you've little to worry about.
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Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Mon 12 Jul 2010, 21:23,
Reply)
I wonder
"Schools with a significant number of Muslim pupils should try to avoid scheduling swimming lessons during Ramadan to remove unnecessary barriers to full participation"
what if my child was in the minority here and prevented from attending swimming lessons during their Ramadan? Or even another religious faith with no observance to Ramadan?
That entire report is complete bollocks
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Jahled Three shades of black, Mon 12 Jul 2010, 21:32,
Reply)
Hmmm...
But there's a difference between being prevented from having swimming lessons, and being prevented at a particular time. And if there's a lot of people in the class who would reject lessons at that time, it may be better - in the sense of less faff - just to bite the bullet.
I take your point, and I'm generally pretty sympathetic - but I'm not wholly convinced that it's all that big an issue.
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Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Mon 12 Jul 2010, 21:35,
Reply)
To be honest
It's silly little reports like this which just float down gently into the hands of cunts like the Daily Mail or the Sun
Why give them the ammunition?
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Jahled Three shades of black, Mon 12 Jul 2010, 21:42,
Reply)
This ^
When we were at school, we did swimming for probably about 1/4 of the year? So if swimming during Ramadan is going to mean finding something else for a large portion of the class to do, wouldn't it just be easier to schedule swimming for some other time?
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Incredibly Ordinary Dave needs your clothes, your boots and your motorcycle, Mon 12 Jul 2010, 21:44,
Reply)
Fuck that
My original point:
www.b3ta.com/links/495996
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Jahled Three shades of black, Mon 12 Jul 2010, 21:55,
Reply)
But they will go swimming, just not at that time.
I'm guessing other schools are the same as mine was, and swimming doesn't happen all year 'round anyway, so what difference does it make if it takes place at some other time of the year?
If they don't want to go swimming during Ramadan, you're not going to change their minds, and short of throwing them into the swimming pool, that means you'll have to have another teacher sit with them and find them something else to do, which is a pain in the bum, so why not just have the swimming in some other month?
If kids really want to go swimming during Ramadan, there are plenty of "Kids swim free" type schemes around.
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Incredibly Ordinary Dave needs your clothes, your boots and your motorcycle, Mon 12 Jul 2010, 22:02,
Reply)
But it wouldn't stop them from swimming.
And it's got nothing to do with hurting their sentiments.
That's what I'm trying to say. =/
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Incredibly Ordinary Dave needs your clothes, your boots and your motorcycle, Mon 12 Jul 2010, 22:25,
Reply)
*Sigh*
For fuck's sake geezer
"I'm guessing other schools are the same as mine was, and swimming doesn't happen all year 'round anyway, so what difference does it make if it takes place at some other time of the year?
If they don't want to go swimming during Ramadan, you're not going to change their minds, and short of throwing them into the swimming pool, that means you'll have to have another teacher sit with them and find them something else to do, which is a pain in the bum, so why not just have the swimming in some other month?"
I don't want any disruption to my child's schedule due to religious belief; why is this so hard to grasp?
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Jahled Three shades of black, Mon 12 Jul 2010, 22:37,
Reply)
It might teach the non-Muslim kids acceptance of other peoples way of lives
Which is no bad thing
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applehead herp derp, Mon 12 Jul 2010, 21:51,
Reply)
i agree
this is a document prepared by:
"EMAS: The Ethnic Minority Achievement Service"
that then states:
"Schools with a significant number of Muslim pupils should try to avoid scheduling
swimming lessons during Ramadan to remove unnecessary barriers to full
participation."
so then the other kids are the minority but their rights are sidelined and the musilim kids rigths come first.
ok.
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Avast is still alive!!!!, Mon 12 Jul 2010, 21:54,
Reply)
I doubt that it would ever happen...
Why?
Because Ramadan lasts for 1 month, usually throughout August and sometimes the first week of September.
This BARELY overlaps with the first week of the new school year.
Ergo, much ado about FUCK ALL!
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mr.dogshit The world's premier anthropomorphic canine faeces, Mon 12 Jul 2010, 22:32,
Reply)
from Enzymes link below
the document states that:
"The Islamic calendar is based on a lunar cycle, therefore, the month of Ramadan
begins 10 or 11 days earlier each year on the Gregorian calendar; hence it takes
Ramadan about 33 years to move through the seasons from January to December"
thus is can be in any month.
www.moderngov.stoke.gov.uk/Published/C00000117/M00003568/AI00022934/$Ramadan1doc.docA.ps.pdf
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Avast is still alive!!!!, Mon 12 Jul 2010, 23:01,
Reply)
Deal with what?
Being bullied by people into religious faith?
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Jahled Three shades of black, Mon 12 Jul 2010, 21:32,
Reply)
Fasting to honour your 'god' is ridiculous,
Believing that water swallowed during swimming is somehow going to anger your god or affect your 'spirituality' in any way is ridiculous. Religious sensibilities should have no bearing on lesson scheduling or any other aspect of public life.
that's what I reckon anyway.
(, Mon 12 Jul 2010, 21:26, Reply)
Now you could follow the link that the BBC provides...
www.moderngov.stoke.gov.uk/Published/C00000117/M00003568/AI00022934/$Ramadan1doc.docA.ps.pdf
And then you could read what the actual document says. It's not what the BBC says it is.
(Incidentally, this story has also been picked up by The Freethinker, which simply repeats the inaccuracies, and whose editors seem to have decided that my comment pointing this out needs to be moderated. Not that I make a habit of pointing out that site's many inaccuracies... oh, no. Well, not much.)
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Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Mon 12 Jul 2010, 21:21,
Reply)
Thanks for the link. KEEP. RELIGION. OUT. OF. SKOOL
"Schools can develop the spiritual, moral social and cultural aspects of their children
and school life by recognising and building upon the essence and spirit of Ramadan."
why? keep religion out of skool.
"Teachers can take this opportunity to be more inclusive and teach pupils about
Ramadan in religious education and to invite guests from the Muslim community to
take collective worship or assemblies"
why? keep religion out of skool.
"The majority of pupils who are fasting are able to take part in most physical activities
during Ramadan without putting themselves at risk or in danger. Fasting may make
some children feel tired or drowsy, or even develop headaches due to dehydration.
This may necessitate some Muslim pupils having to reduce their physical exercise.
Schools may wish to consider and plan less strenuous activities in physical education
lessons during Ramadan."
why? keep religion out of skool.
"No oral medication can be taken by a person who is fasting. Anyone needing regular
medication during fasting hours is normally exempt from fasting in any case.
Medication can be taken once the fast has ended. Medical injections can be taken by
a person who is fasting, although not those injections that influence body nutrition."
Better not have an accident that requires a saline drip then huh?
"When Ramadan falls during the winter months, after-school detention or activities for
a pupil who is fasting could mean that the pupil is not able to reach home in time to
break their fast. Whilst accepting full responsibility for breaching school rules,
schools should be aware that pupils are able carry out their religious duty of breaking
the fast on time. A drink or anything to eat is sufficient and many schools do make
this provision available when required. Some parents may request that their children
break the fast at home with their family."
(my italics) So if they do request this, then the kids piss about in class then what?
"Festival of Sacrifice (Eid ul-Adha)
Eid ul-Adha celebrates the completion of the Hajj (the annual pilgrimage to Makkah)
In many countries after the public prayers, those who can afford to, sacrifice a lamb or
a goat to signify the Prophet Ibrahim’s (Abraham’s) obedience to God, shown by his
readiness to sacrifice his son Ismail (Ishmael)."
Yeah, cos killing your kid cos of voices in your head should be celebrated.
"Schools can recognise and celebrate the Eid festivals by highlighting the importance
of the message of Eid through collective worship and assemblies. Schools may want
to share sweets amongst all children to mark this event."
I wouldn't want my kids propagandised with any form of intolerant religious bullshit, whatever the religion.
"In the vast majority of primary schools, when changing for PE, both boys and girls
have no choice but to change in mixed group environments for sports activities.
Muslim children are likely to exhibit resistance to this sort of compromising and
immodest exposure, but are often pressurised to conform to institutional norms which
do not take account of their own or their parents’ beliefs and values."
wow, like all religions, the brainwashing starts early.
"In secondary schools, changing facilities are always gender specific but almost always
communal. Communal changing compromises the Islamic modesty requirements and
having to change down to their undergarments in the presence of their peers and
teachers can be a source of embarrassment or even be undignifying for many pupils"
ffs.
"Some schools may have policies for children to shower at school after sports
activities. These arrangements sometimes take the form of naked communal
showering, which involves profound indignity. The practice of allowing Muslim
children to shower in bathing costumes or shorts does not solve the problem if other
pupils are naked in the same communal shower area. Islam forbids nakedness in front
of others or being among others who are naked.
Muslim children should not be expected to participate in communal showering.
Sensitivity and understanding by school and staff in these matters will be much
appreciated by both Muslim pupils and their parents. One practical solution in a
school environment would be the installation of individual shower cubicles. In the
absence of separate cubicles for changing and showering, Muslim children should be
allowed to delay showering until they reach home."
profound indignity? just wow. not showering till they get home? what if (like when i was at school) PE was sometimes in the morning?
KEEP. RELIGION. OUT. OF. SKOOL
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Avast is still alive!!!!, Mon 12 Jul 2010, 21:50,
Reply)
what are you trying to say?
:)
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Damocles wants no part of your debauchery, Mon 12 Jul 2010, 22:19,
Reply)
not shure really. *mumbles* something something religion something
;)
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Avast is still alive!!!!, Mon 12 Jul 2010, 22:29,
Reply)
Mmmmm
Let's impose secularism on everyone, rather than doing the hard work of living together. Live and let live (as long as you all live the secularist way).
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Yell Whoop continued to be a nin-com-poop on, Tue 13 Jul 2010, 12:36,
Reply)
fuck this shit
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(|D[ekionplexis B3ta.com: fictional child porn is OK, Mon 12 Jul 2010, 22:17,
Reply)
WHAT COMPLETE AND UTTER SHIT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
RAMADAN 2010 = 11 August - 9 September
New school year starts Tuesday 7 September
Also, what school schedules swimming for the 1st day of term? None of them.
Second day of term? I would bet a large sum of money - none of them. That leaves the third day (the 9th). Personally, I would doubt any normal school would schedule any sort of PE with specific kit requirements during the first week, full stop! It's all admin, registers, new exercise books, curriculum outlay during the first week.
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mr.dogshit The world's premier anthropomorphic canine faeces, Mon 12 Jul 2010, 22:38,
Reply)
I wish this comment could be up-voted to the top!
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applehead herp derp, Mon 12 Jul 2010, 23:00,
Reply)
as replied above...
the document states that:
"The Islamic calendar is based on a lunar cycle, therefore, the month of Ramadan
begins 10 or 11 days earlier each year on the Gregorian calendar; hence it takes
Ramadan about 33 years to move through the seasons from January to December"
thus is can be in any month.
www.moderngov.stoke.gov.uk/Published/C00000117/M00003568/AI00022934/$Ramadan1doc.docA.ps.pdf
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Avast is still alive!!!!, Mon 12 Jul 2010, 23:03,
Reply)
but for this year, the dates are as stated above and overlap the school calendar by 3 irrelevant days. (google "ramadan 2010")
So is this whole issue about the disruption that may (but probably wont) be caused... in 7 years time when ramadan next overlaps the UK school calendar?
As stated above, much ado about fuck all.
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mr.dogshit The world's premier anthropomorphic canine faeces, Tue 13 Jul 2010, 1:31,
Reply)
Bearing in mind this is a school swimming pool,
and therefore full of kiddy piss and shit particles, I would advise against EVER drinking the water.
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JamTallons, Tue 13 Jul 2010, 10:19,
Reply)