Tangent, but related to discussions above...
Can someone explain to me why marriages (civil partnerships etc.) are seen as making relationships stronger, better, more stable etc?

I'd have thought the quality of a relationship was down to the people involved, their personalities and how they interact, rather than a peace of paper that may, or may not have legal mumbo jumbo attached to it.
( CQ Knows the truth, all of it., Wed 12 May 2010, 16:45, 6 replies, latest was 16 years ago)

It's a traditionalist thing
marriages were originally stronger because divorce wasn't an option. It's not necessarily true anymore because you can divorce at the drop of a hat, but I personally still want to get married because I like the idea of it. I know it's only 'a piece of paper' but I would want my kids to all have the same name and when I get married I intend it to be forever, so I think of it as signifying a strong union.
( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Wed 12 May 2010, 16:49, Reply)

signfying a strong union succinctly puts my view of it
that's why I'm doing it. I'm not intending to have any kids, so the name thing isn't an issue, but if I was, then it would be.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Wed 12 May 2010, 16:51, Reply)

It kind of bugs me when people say it doesn't mean anything
because it does to me. One of my friends said she was surprised that I wanted to get married because she thought I was more sensible than that which really pissed me off because it might be a silly tradition that doesn't have the same value as it did 500 years ago, but I still think it's the strongest of committments. She described it as a person's way of making sure the other person never leaves, which was cynical and not really true now that divorce is so easy.

Really I just want a massive dress and for everyone to pay attention to me for the day.
( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Wed 12 May 2010, 16:56, Reply)

I agree with you about the commitment
I love Mrs V, and a very good way of showing that is marrying her. so I'm going to.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:00, Reply)

damn that was my plan
she shall have to choose between us.

I challenge you to a duel!

*glove slaps*
( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:04, Reply)

oh god
not another b3ta woman who wants my gf....
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:05, Reply)

I feel your pain
Ever since I pointed out the Matt Bellamy thing in Wiggy the boys* are lining up to have me killed.

*May only be Darth Foxtrot
( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:10, Reply)

thanks :-)
he is a colossal dirt-road bandito

Darth Foxtrot that is
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:18, Reply)

BACK OFF KITZO

( Roota zweeeeeoooooowm, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:19, Reply)

*is genuinely a little scared*
O_O
( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:37, Reply)

not quite the drop of a hat
speaking as someone who's going through an uncontested divorce, it still takes a year or 2 and costs a few hundred quid, but relatively speaking, point taken.Point about signifying a strong union also, although personally when I had the commitment to a lifelong relationship I didn't feel I needed the marriage to formalize it, and at the point that things broke down irretrievably, that commitment was lost, and the marriage, was again, irrelevant.
( CQ Knows the truth, all of it., Wed 12 May 2010, 16:55, Reply)

I know, with divorce being so prevalent it does seem that marriage is just a pointless formality nowadays
but I still like the idea of having a husband and being someone's wife rather than just 'boyfriend and girlfriend' forever, as that seems so casual and almost teenager-like. I understand why people think you shouldn't have to have a big ceremony to be committed to someone forever, but sometimes it's nice to be traditional.
( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Wed 12 May 2010, 16:58, Reply)

I would not dream of denying you the right to you ceremony
nor mocking you for it. My question, I suppose is more, is my commitment to be counted for less because it does not come with the same ceremony.
( CQ Knows the truth, all of it., Wed 12 May 2010, 17:00, Reply)

not at all
except in a legal sense, which is unfortunate but that's the way it is

the law frowns on my close relationship with Mary Jane, but that doesn't stop it going on.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:02, Reply)

It's true,
it's a bit unfair that things like insurance go down if you're married, but unfortunately that's the way the law works in this country at the moment.
( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:05, Reply)

insurance goes down?
I am woefully ignorant of the financial implications of being married.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:17, Reply)

I think your life expectancy goes up
dunno why, but heard it somewhere.
( CQ Knows the truth, all of it., Wed 12 May 2010, 17:25, Reply)

yeah, apparently you drive more safely when married
until the marriage breaks down and then you strap the kids into the back, telling them you're going for a picnic when really you're going to take them deep-lake diving without the scuba gear.
( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:38, Reply)

excellent
it looks more promising all the time!
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:39, Reply)

I may be wrong
but it's not the piece of paper that does it, but what the paper represents, a strong and binding commitment between two people, financially (because weddings are usually fucking expensive) and otherwise.

in practice this is not quite the case, as any old twat gets married to some bint these days *looks at NakedApe*
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Wed 12 May 2010, 16:50, Reply)

*puts mirror between you and NakedApe*

(PsychoChomp, Wed 12 May 2010, 16:55, Reply)

well, hello.....

( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Wed 12 May 2010, 16:59, Reply)

It's something to do with benders.

( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 12 May 2010, 16:51, Reply)

then you must know all about it

( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Wed 12 May 2010, 16:52, Reply)

ZING!

( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Wed 12 May 2010, 16:53, Reply)

I challenge that ZING.

( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 12 May 2010, 16:54, Reply)

I should,
but I confess when you were telling me all about it I simply wasn't listening, sorry.
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 12 May 2010, 16:53, Reply)

too busy staring at my groin eh?

( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Wed 12 May 2010, 16:54, Reply)

I was, yes.
Staring, and pitying your poor under-serviced fiancee.
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 12 May 2010, 16:56, Reply)

neither she, nor your mother have had any cause to complain about my servicing of them
both remain very satisfied
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Wed 12 May 2010, 16:58, Reply)

Funny - they both complain to me about it on a regular basis.
My mother when I take tea with her, and your missus when I backscuttle her in Morrison's car park.
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:09, Reply)

I'm sure I've mentioned to you before that it's my missus
it's someone else in drag. I suspect Al
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:14, Reply)

Your missus looks like Al in drag?
HOT.
(wellgroomedwookiee is a filthy-minded hobgoblin, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:35, Reply)

I know right?

( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:38, Reply)

A committment I guess
Marriage indicates at least your intent to try and stay together whether there are children or not. A lot of people view it as more than a piece of paper,- as an actual committment
( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Wed 12 May 2010, 16:54, Reply)

Yes, but if you have that commitment, why must it be written down?
and if you lose such a commitment, what good does having it written down do?
( CQ Knows the truth, all of it., Wed 12 May 2010, 16:57, Reply)

the piece of paper isn't the commitment
it's what it represents. the actual certificate is irrelevant except in a legal sense.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Wed 12 May 2010, 16:59, Reply)

you're missing the point
marriage is more than a piece of paper having 'marriage' written on it. It's an open and visible symbol of committment- sometimes an expensive one true, but always a clear symbol of the regard you feel.

If you lose such a committment, it's sad, but I can't see the harm of having had it in the past
( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:00, Reply)

I think this is my point
The commitment is what matters, the paper, the ceremony, all the rest are just symbols.
( CQ Knows the truth, all of it., Wed 12 May 2010, 17:02, Reply)

that doesn't always mean they aren't good things though
and having been through the process of displaying these symbols, the theory is that it will make for a stronger relationship.

That isn't necessarily the case though.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:03, Reply)

Would not dream of saying they aren't good things
merely questioning their necessity.
( CQ Knows the truth, all of it., Wed 12 May 2010, 17:11, Reply)

certainly not necessary
it is entirely up to the individual
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:12, Reply)

Wine isn't necessary
But it's brilliant and I hereby pledge my commitment to our relationship
( Roota zweeeeeoooooowm, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:13, Reply)

you're still missing the point
it's easy to say you have a committment. To follow that through and make a lasting acknowledgement in the form of an open/honest committment whether in a religious or civil ceremony is more of a leap
( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:03, Reply)

It's true
symbols are symbols for a reason, they are physical objects that are created to represent untangible things such as emotion and in this case committment. Like when people are given Medals of Honour.
( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:07, Reply)

kindly stop telling me I am missing the point
I am disagreeing with you, which is not quite the same thing.Your point seems to be that my feelings are some how more valid if "make a lasting acknowledgement in the form of an open/honest [statement or display of] commitment" My contention is that the feelings involved are more important than how they are publicly expressed or solemnified.
( CQ Knows the truth, all of it., Wed 12 May 2010, 17:08, Reply)

I feel that you are correct in this instance.

( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:10, Reply)

Well, as long a b3ta's resident relation ship expert agrees with me...
How can I be wrong. :)
( CQ Knows the truth, all of it., Wed 12 May 2010, 17:13, Reply)

definatly missing the point

(PsychoChomp, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:11, Reply)

you are missing the point *chortle*
not really. it's more a case of debating slightly different things.

The emotions aren't more valid either way, but a marriage is more than just a piece of paper, it is an outward display of commitment to the emotions.

It's not necessary, but some people want to do it and the theory is that having some kind of commitment while make for a stronger relationship, although that is not always the case.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:11, Reply)

I claimed
you were missing the point because you kept asking why it should be written down, and I answered that 2 or 3 times
( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:11, Reply)

you answered (repeatedly) by saying the piece of paper was not the point, the commitment is symbolised was
what you did not do, was explain, why the paper (or any of the rituals and legal formalities) were necessary, in addition to the commitment they symbolise.
( CQ Knows the truth, all of it., Wed 12 May 2010, 17:23, Reply)

It's the publicity.
All about the ME ME ME factor is marriage.
(porkylips looks better as the sun goes down., Wed 12 May 2010, 17:24, Reply)

well, this would explain
why women are so fond of the idea
( CQ Knows the truth, all of it., Wed 12 May 2010, 17:27, Reply)

Loads of men like it too
My uncle Terry for one was over the moon with all that wedding stuff.
My auntie could have taken it or left it.
( Roota zweeeeeoooooowm, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:29, Reply)

your uncle Terry
is clearly a girly in disguise
( CQ Knows the truth, all of it., Wed 12 May 2010, 17:31, Reply)

That has been discussed

( Roota zweeeeeoooooowm, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:33, Reply)

one of my male friends wants to get married
but his girlfriend doesn't.

In my opinion she should take what she can get.
( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:39, Reply)

Also please remember
that it's a strange state of affairs where my parents would be financially better off if they chose to divorce, than by staying together as they currently are
( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:02, Reply)

I would've been much better off at uni if my parents had got a divorce
the selfish bastards.

they can sod their 40 years of marriage.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:04, Reply)

exactly
my mother would get so much more money if she was a single mother, and my time at university would be much easier.

There was almost a point where the difference was so overwhelming they were thinking of getting seperated because of it. Luckily they didn't
( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:06, Reply)

It's like this:
See you, you're the most brilliant person in my world. I'm not just going to GO OUT with you or LIVE with you, I'm going to MARRY you.
We'll be each other's Mister/Missus.
And to everyone else: See this cracker here, this cracker is the best thing since sliced bread. We are getting married, that how boss we each think the other is. We're bothering to do all that 'I do' biznizz.
Then we're going to Llandudno to have all of the sex.
I thank you.
( Roota zweeeeeoooooowm, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:07, Reply)

that's my wedding day speech sorted
ta duck
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:08, Reply)

You're welcome luv
Took me ages to write.
( Roota zweeeeeoooooowm, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:10, Reply)

I'll give you writing credits when I present it at my wedding

( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:12, Reply)

It's ok
You can have it as a wedding present
( Roota zweeeeeoooooowm, Wed 12 May 2010, 17:14, Reply)