In which Chickenlady confronts pr0n
Okay, I admit it: I am a nosey mother and I listened to all the government and Jo Frost directives about keeping an eye on what your children are looking at online. Until about eighteen months ago the family desktop sat at the back of the sitting room so no unpleasant sites could be accessed by my pre-pubescent sons without everyone seeing. I was sure this would protect my innocent children from seeing any vile filth peddled by dodgy types based in dingy attics and run by an overweight, sweaty bald man called Malcolm.
I was wrong.
The first thing that alerted me was the giggling - Lego.com never made them giggle like that. Neither did any of the sites that were recommended by Cbeebies, well apart from the Dick and Dom Poo game. So my first thought was that they had found another such Poo game - poo is always so entertaining for young boys I find. Many hours had been spent in our garden identifying animal poo but I hadn't yet introduced them to the Bristol Stool Chart or RateMyPoo.com. However, the giggles were not the result of a bit of good clean poo punnery, no.
I was suspicious, very suspicious. Rather than interrogate them and lose their trust I decided to ask Satsuma Man (OH) to do the interrogation - he has German heritage so I was expecting full on torches shone in faces, and veiled threats about the 'war being over' for them. I left them to it and returned to watching The World's Toughest Parents.
Some time later Satsuma Man informed me that my darkest fears had been realised; my sons had indeed been looking at pr0n online.
My sons were ten years old at the time - they did not know about the dark ways of the world. My liberal sensibilities were put aside and out came my Strident Feminist hat...well, I wouldn't really call it a hat; feminists aren't really known for hat wearing. Maybe more of a Strident Feminist Orthopaedic Sandal, not that I own any Orthopaedic Sandals at the moment though, I do have a rather fetching pair of Vivienne Westwood sandals. I suppose I'd have to call them NuFeminist though. Postmodern Feminist?
Anyway, the time had come for me to get out the big guns.

Pr0n is bad.

That's the short version which was at the forefront of my mind; very simplistic, very black and white (although the internet does it in colour now), no middle ground, no messing. What I said to the boys (with tearful eyes) was....

"You do realise that each of these girls you're looking at is someone's daughter or sister?

How would you feel if that was one of your friends, your cousin?

They're being exploited. Do you think they want to show their bodies off like this for the world to see?


Don't you realise they're all on drugs - they have to be in order to put aside the horrific nature of what they are doing?

Women are not objects for you to look at and laugh over. These women have feelings, opinions and thoughts.

Who do you think is making money out of this? Yes, drug dealers, human traffickers, evil people. Evil!

And you two, sitting sniggering over some poor girl, drugged up to the eyeballs, forced to display her body, force to commit horrific lewd and perverted acts with men she doesn't know all so she can get her next fix of drugs to stop her feeling the pain of her existence. How could you?!

I'm ashamed. Ashamed and disappointed that you would do this.

I want to know now, what you were looking for and why."

By this time both lads looked contrite; heads hung low and slight sniffing from tears of self-pity.

"Well? I'm waiting."

Finally the reply....

"We're doing a project on garden birds at school. We did an image search for Big Tits"
( chickenlady b3ta's very own Elizabeth Taylor, Fri 12 Aug 2011, 14:19, 34 replies)

So you didn't go into the bit about how some girls actually enjoy it, then
and that many girls actually enjoy sex, and that showing themselves off is a turn-on, and that they lust after boys just as boys lust after girls?

Way to go. From now on, they will treat women as treasures - things to obtain, as something of status, something to be put on a pedastal. They will be easy to emotionally manipulate and blackmail by unscrupulous girls who want to use them for their own ends. They will perceive women to be "other", some sort of wild, unimaginable, ununderstandable territory, instead of equals.

Hurrah! Equality for all! Except men. Because men are bastards.
( Je suis un vagabond is an unfunny, up your own arse middle class knob, Fri 12 Aug 2011, 14:26, closed)

So much for my attempts at humour
*sigh*
I'll go back to making jam.
( chickenlady b3ta's very own Elizabeth Taylor, Fri 12 Aug 2011, 14:30, closed)

I liked it, I thought it was funny.
I like the mental image of two chastened lads, admitting to looking for Big Tits.

But the whole "Women in pr0n are all junkies and don't want to be there, pr0n is exclusively male, pr0n is only ever men exploiting vulnerable women" thing is absolute nonsense, and I get kind of fed up with it, as I was brought up on a similar diet of 1980s being a male is wrong attitude. It can be really quite destructive - actually some girls actually WANT to have and ENJOY having sex, and to portray them as otherwise is wrong.

The top earners in pr0n are women. It's the one industry where that's the case.

/opinionslol
( Je suis un vagabond is an unfunny, up your own arse middle class knob, Fri 12 Aug 2011, 14:34, closed)

I want to have sex.
*puts up hand*

Although the only reason the women are the top earners is because the male viewers don't care who's fucking them, they're there to watch the women.
( girlinthehole, Fri 12 Aug 2011, 14:37, closed)

*puts up hand*?
Thats just showing off

now clap!
(the_icks has the sweet essence of giraffe, Fri 12 Aug 2011, 15:18, closed)

I agree entirely and the actual conversation did include some of that
and 'perhaps' wasn't quite as strident as my story makes out...artistic license.
That said, I did push the point that these are real people and not just objects and relationships are with people and not screens.
( chickenlady b3ta's very own Elizabeth Taylor, Fri 12 Aug 2011, 14:38, closed)

You see, you should really lie to children about sex - it's a lot more fun.
Try telling them that men can get pregnant and that the babies come out of their bum. Ace fun.
( Je suis un vagabond is an unfunny, up your own arse middle class knob, Fri 12 Aug 2011, 14:41, closed)

Of course girls want to have and enjoy sex
Porn is a completely different matter innit.

I read Jenna Jameson's autobiography (I can't really explain that one beyond prurient curiosity and a hangover) - she points out that 97% of female adult actresses were abused as children (including her.) 97%.

But yeah, they all totally love it.
(jennymnemonic, Fri 12 Aug 2011, 15:00, closed)

I deliberately did not use the word "all".
The 97% stat is entirely spurious without back-up, and doesn't take into account the increasing amounts of home-made pr0n.
( Je suis un vagabond is an unfunny, up your own arse middle class knob, Fri 12 Aug 2011, 15:41, closed)

So what percentage do then?

( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Fri 12 Aug 2011, 15:42, closed)

I've no idea.
But I do know that many girls - certainly the ones around me - want to have sex, and also enjoy sex, and that some get off on showing themselves off.
( Je suis un vagabond is an unfunny, up your own arse middle class knob, Fri 12 Aug 2011, 15:44, closed)

I don't think anyone is denying that
the denial comes from the idea that those women are the ones making porn. It might be nicer and simpler to say 'of course they enjoy it, and are doing it in a sexually liberated fashion, being paid a decent wage, treated like human beings, and are DEFINITELY not trafficked into it or abused or raped at any stage' because it prevents any need to think about it or question it. Some of them are obviously. A lot of them aren't. I don't think you can very easily tell the difference.

Bugger. Way too serious for the internet
( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Fri 12 Aug 2011, 15:47, closed)

Yes - I've already personally apologised to chickenlady for being a humourless twat about it all.
Have a good Friday - I'm off to try and get my Mrs drunk.
( Je suis un vagabond is an unfunny, up your own arse middle class knob, Fri 12 Aug 2011, 16:00, closed)

Some of the most horrifying porn I've ever seen
has been some stuff where the women's expressions are empty. Where their mouths are smiling but their eyes are vacant. Or where their mouths are smiling, but their eyes have that glint of horror, as if one last vestige of the soul is crying out for rescue.

I've seen some pretty eye-watering stuff, a lot of which didn't turn me on, but the stuff which has actually made me question the legitimacy of the porn business is the stuff where the women honestly look like they're hating everything they're doing.

Nothing wrong with filming people fucking, but for God's sake leave it to those who genuinely enjoy it.
( flake has nothing against your right leg, Fri 12 Aug 2011, 16:49, closed)

Well said!

( Tourette's ( . )( . ) has a monkey hair in her fried egg, Tue 16 Aug 2011, 2:06, closed)

Uhuh. But why support an industry that is exploitative and abusive
just because a few women are having a good time?
( crackhouseceilidhband Fuck off back to Mumsnet, Fri 12 Aug 2011, 16:30, closed)

Good point.
Down with the 24/7 IT support business.
( flake has nothing against your right leg, Fri 12 Aug 2011, 16:44, closed)

*ponders*
*quits job in academia*
( crackhouseceilidhband Fuck off back to Mumsnet, Fri 12 Aug 2011, 16:47, closed)

Bobbi Starr has an interesting take on it.
Starr considers herself a pro-sex feminist. Even though she acknowledges that some feminists consider pornography to be degrading to women, Starr asserts, "I don't feel degraded because it is my decision. I know that if I did ever feel degraded or feel uncomfortable, all I need to do is say no and it would stop. I don't think something where women have so much control in the situation can be considered degrading towards women.

Taken from Wikipedia: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bobbi_Starr
( The Resident Loon Not a demographic. Do not measure., Fri 12 Aug 2011, 22:54, closed)

Isn't it nice that she has control?
Point still stands: just because some women have control doesn't make it any less exploitative and abusive for the women who don't.

I would also describe myself as a pro-sex feminist. However, I'm a pro-sex feminist who doesn't like seeing people being mistreated.
( crackhouseceilidhband Fuck off back to Mumsnet, Mon 15 Aug 2011, 11:29, closed)

Good point
I shall boycott Primark forthwith
( emvee cruor deo cruoris, Mon 15 Aug 2011, 15:56, closed)

So…
They're liars as well as perverts.
(mark schmark, Fri 12 Aug 2011, 14:27, closed)

Well, this is QOTW...

( chickenlady b3ta's very own Elizabeth Taylor, Fri 12 Aug 2011, 14:31, closed)

The subsequent google search for "Deutsche Scheiße Pron" was nothing to do with me ...

(Bicycle Repairman "you're also a bit of a wanker", Fri 12 Aug 2011, 14:32, closed)

What's the German for "satsuma scat"?

( crackhouseceilidhband Fuck off back to Mumsnet, Fri 12 Aug 2011, 16:49, closed)

BBC News
Apparently "great tits" in the UK are starting to have lesions appearing on them. Blue tits aren't affected, so Avatar porn is safe.
(Klangtarnflatchslapper looks just like a Telefunken U-47, Fri 12 Aug 2011, 15:15, closed)

3 stereotypes (germans, feminists, porn skanks),
and a terrbile joke (big tits).

You don't even have any children, do you?
( monster munch person, man, woman... camera... TV?, Fri 12 Aug 2011, 15:29, closed)

Full marks to your sons.
I don't think I could have lied on demand that quickly when I was their age.

You should be proud of raising such quick-witted young men.
( flake has nothing against your right leg, Fri 12 Aug 2011, 16:43, closed)

I'm just pleased...
Because now I can look at tits and boobies on the net and explain it all away.

Oh, and cocks, apparently.

!
(Chickenwire social lubricator extraordinaire, Fri 12 Aug 2011, 20:21, closed)

*APPLAUSE*
For a brilliantly written humorous post - in the true spirit of B3ta \o/

For all I have the utmost admiration for chickenlady's restraint regarding some of the replies here, I am not blessed with such delicate tact. This fine lady has raised two splendid sons, despite many challenges - anyone wanting to pick at *their perception of* her morals can plough through me first xxx
( Tourette's ( . )( . ) has a monkey hair in her fried egg, Tue 16 Aug 2011, 2:01, closed)

Yeah
and they'll have to fight their way past me first too.


I also happen to agree with her. I'm glad we don't have a boy, as trying to pick your way through the minefield that is porn on the internet while they are young, developing people can be no easy task.

I have nothing but sympathy for girls growing up these days trying to live up to boys' expectations of what a woman is and what they are expected to do for a boy.

Not all girls will want to engage in anal or have cum sprayed all over their faces when they finally find a young man to have a relationship with, but if this is what they've been wanking over for the last five years, they will surely feel let down if their partner wants simple intercourse under the covers before they gain a bit of confidence.

Or am I wrong?
(Che Grimsdale Best before:, Tue 16 Aug 2011, 11:13, closed)

Aww
You're both too kind. :)

The fiver is in the post, as normal
( chickenlady b3ta's very own Elizabeth Taylor, Tue 16 Aug 2011, 12:55, closed)

I like this reply
*clicks*
(Bicycle Repairman "you're also a bit of a wanker", Tue 16 Aug 2011, 15:42, closed)

That had me in fits
Great story and well told. Thanks for sharing.
( Rev. Jayneflakes Buy my book, I need the cash for drugs and hookers, Tue 16 Aug 2011, 19:55, closed)