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This is a question Sexism

Freddie Woo tells us: Despite being a well rounded modern man I think women are best off getting married and having a few kids else they'll be absolutely miserable come middle age.

What views do you have that are probably sexist that you believe are true?

(, Sun 27 Dec 2009, 12:23)
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I have rather large and eclectic collection of music that I've plundered from the interwebs over the years (about 50 Gig) mainly consisting of rock, indie and electronica.
One startling thing I've noticed is that I only have the work of one female musician (Bjork) and only about 2 albums on which a female singer features prominently. Usually women, where they do exist in the music I own are made to content themselves with the position of bassist or drummer.

This can't be simply because I don't enjoy female singing. Lots of the music I listen to is electronic and so has no vocals (such as Aphex Twin or BoC). As far as I am aware there are no female producers of this kind of music. Of course there must be, but I've not heard of any.
One hypothesis is that teenage girls just aren't as geeky as boys, meaning that they don't spend days and days sat alone with computers or with their friends in grotty studios producing music. Or maybe it's very difficult to market the work of a woman who isn't highly visible & attractive.

Sorry for length/ incoherence of argument.
(, Sun 27 Dec 2009, 20:18, 33 replies)
I'm pretty much the same
although not quite to the same degree. I have a few more female artists than that, various indie stuff and a few girly pop things but my collection is easily 95% male, entirely by coincidence. I'll listen to any old shite, regardless of who's making the noise. My old theory was that girls don't seem to have the same impetus to pick up a guitar and make a noise. I'm gradually proving myself wrong on that, or maybe it's them that's proving me wrong, I dunno.

I know a lot of people, male and female, who will only listen to female vocalists. They're all pop and R&B fans, maybe there's something in the genre difference.
(, Sun 27 Dec 2009, 20:40, closed)
Turns out I was exaggerating
On looking through my iTunes again I found about 5 artists with female front(wo)man lurking there. But even that only adds up to about 15 albums and there are absolutely none by all-girl bands.
Still a major sausage-fest in there.
(, Sun 27 Dec 2009, 20:56, closed)
I remember this falling into the convo I had with my dad about comedy, too!
There are a few FANTASTIC female music geeks, though.

-IMOGEN HEAP. Seriously, Imogen Heap is the biggest music geek I have heard of.
-Also the nice lady from Massive Attack
-Don't forget Kimya Dawson (Moldy Peaches)
-Emmy the Great
-Coco Rosie

(it seems a lot of these are antifolk, or folk)

I've noticed a lot of women doing films or comedy, though. The producer of Father Ted is a woman. And Diablo Cody did Juno. A lot of the 'Buffy' writers were female, too.
(, Sun 27 Dec 2009, 20:52, closed)
Nice lady from Massive Attack
is a good example of a female session musician in an all male band.This is the case in a lot of the music by electronic outfits I have. It's a slightly troubling trend.
The other people you name here tend to be visible singer/songwriters rather than anonymous producers of music of the kind I describe. There is no shortage of female music geeks though. I'll have to seek some out by way of broadening my tastes. Affirmative action and all that :p
(, Sun 27 Dec 2009, 21:10, closed)
Imogen Heap is a producer
She has all the loopers/synth/kit etc. She's fantastic :)
(, Sun 27 Dec 2009, 21:15, closed)
She is rather
gave her a listen just then. Will have to download methinks...
Quite similar to Bjork in style. I'd call her a singer/songwriter more than producer though.
(, Sun 27 Dec 2009, 21:24, closed)
If you like Bjork and Imogen Heap, you should track down...
...Imogen Heap's old band with Guy Sigsworth called "Frou Frou." Guy performed on and produced a lot of Bjork's earlier work and the connection is audible (tight programming in particular) when you are listening for it.

If you like Imogen Heap's solo stuff, you should definitely also track down Kate Havnevik's stuff - New Day is 7 minutes 43 seconds of bliss...

Actually, there's a whole streaming US public radio station out there that plays only those eclectic female artists (either soloists or fronting bands) that often turn out to be real gems - it's on iTunes and the web: KGRL.
(, Sun 27 Dec 2009, 22:36, closed)
One of their songs
was in the film "Garden State"...at the end.

It was one of the reasons I had even heard of the film to be able to watch it. If you haven't, I wouldn't bother, but get Details (the album) because it is lovely.
(, Sun 27 Dec 2009, 23:06, closed)
There aren't a lot of female electronic music producers but ...
Some of the best DJ's are ladies:

Miss Kittin (also a producer)

And Kelis is a badass....
(, Sun 27 Dec 2009, 21:11, closed)
I'm a DJ : )
Pretty much every time I do a gig, open up for a band... even at my regular weekly night, I get people come up to me and say, "I don't ever see female DJS!" They ask me how I got into it, admire my equipment (ey up, you) and so on. Thing is - I'm not a great DJ by any means. I just stand out coz I'm a girl.

Kelis is awesome. I really like 'Trick Me'.
(, Sun 27 Dec 2009, 21:15, closed)
And another thing
If I'm in a club I would rather gurn in the general direction of Miss Kittin in a black catsuit than Meat Katie.

Maybe that's my sexist view....
(, Sun 27 Dec 2009, 21:24, closed)
Me too :D

(I got vaguely offended then, as my name is Katie, but then realised you wouldn't have known that)
(, Sun 27 Dec 2009, 21:27, closed)
I should have just said Mark Pember.... He's like the Phil Mitchell of Breakbeat
(, Sun 27 Dec 2009, 21:29, closed)
Saw this cool post...

BTW, as a female DJ do you often get a patronising educational demonstration of the decks and mixer from any male DJ who happens to be around when you arrive with your tunes?
(, Sun 27 Dec 2009, 23:12, closed)
I don't think anyone would - not for the sort of stuff I do, anyway. If I'm using someone else's kit, they will normally give me a quick demo, but not in a patronising way. A few times I have 'interned' with some really talented guys, and I've just sat back in awe as they do their thing. They could be a bit moody if I got in the way, but I think that's more to do with the distraction rather than me being a girl.

Even my boss doesn't know how to set up my kit 100% right. And he owns some of it!

People have tried asking if I need help - the only thing I get them to do is to carry the heavy stuff & get things off hight shelves (I'm 5ft nothing) :D
(, Mon 28 Dec 2009, 0:25, closed)
that's probably part of the problem. Successful men often aren't easy on the eye. Successful women usually are.
(, Sun 27 Dec 2009, 21:36, closed)
Susan Boyle
Dawn French
Kathy Burke
Whoopi Goldberg
Tamsin Greig

Oh yeh, they're all so fit.
(, Sun 27 Dec 2009, 22:23, closed)
Tamsin Greig is fit!
Susan Boyle is famous BECAUSE she's ugly, making her a total anomaly.
And the others are all character actors.
(, Mon 28 Dec 2009, 1:39, closed)
I wouldn't say Tamsin Greig is classically pretty
I think she's handsome. I know that's a weird word to describe a woman, but mehhh
(, Mon 28 Dec 2009, 1:43, closed)
some of my fav djs are female
Sarah C. and Metz from Leeds, Jen Mas, Ellen Allien, and DJ WoNK are all great DJs, but most female DJs are kind of crap and get gigs due to their looks
(, Mon 28 Dec 2009, 1:12, closed)
Apparently it's evolutionary...
(This could be my sexist view actually).

Creativity is generally a male trait, and allows genetically superior men to demonstrate their mad skills and then women fall about in awe and have their babies. Women (as the selective sex) don't "need" to be creative...although here are some fantastically creative women, but like you say, it's mainly men.
(, Sun 27 Dec 2009, 21:20, closed)
don't think that's gonna be a popular response, no matter how much irony you drape it in...
I don't necessarily think men are any more creative but I think that the habits of teenage boys and girls are dictated somewhat by culture. It isn't THAT common for a bunch of young teenage girls to get together and try and emulate their musical heroes:
14 year old boys wanna form a rock band. 14 year old girls wanna sleep with boys from rock bands.
(, Sun 27 Dec 2009, 21:30, closed)
it's just
what I think... I've looked into it.
(, Sun 27 Dec 2009, 21:36, closed)
Reads profile ...
... notes "I live with a crazy inventor in a weird old village hall in the depths of County Durham" ...

... assumes that you're straight and ponders...
(, Sun 27 Dec 2009, 22:38, closed)
It's like birds.
Males are all colorful, females are drab.
(, Sun 27 Dec 2009, 22:46, closed)
Not like birds at all!
The general discussion here is that men can be ugly and successful, but women are a pretty face and that's it.
(, Sun 27 Dec 2009, 22:52, closed)
Delia Derbyshire
Pioneer in electronic music in the 1960s - you've probably heard some of her stuff already...
(, Sun 27 Dec 2009, 21:27, closed)
Ah yes...
absolute pioneer.

Also another good example of sexism. She didn't get the recognition etc...
(, Sun 27 Dec 2009, 21:28, closed)
that's mental
I've NEVER heard of her. This is exactly what I'm talking about when I say I've never heard of a female electronic music producer. Tragic really.
(, Sun 27 Dec 2009, 21:32, closed)
I was going to say
Is it possible to be a fan of the likes of Aphex Twin without having heard her name?
(, Mon 28 Dec 2009, 19:35, closed)
Is it because
The vast majority of electronic "music" is total shit, and only a man would be stupid or obsessive enough to waste his life on such a gigantic pile of garbage?
(, Thu 31 Dec 2009, 14:56, closed)
Shouldn't you..
be cooking or cleaning or something?
(, Sun 3 Jan 2010, 11:33, closed)
What do you mean?

(, Mon 4 Jan 2010, 11:46, closed)

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