Ask Epicurus
I no longer watch The News, or anything grown up like Question Time. I avoid newspapers.

I get books out of the library, drink £1.50 pints of IPA in Wetherspoons, and invest time and energy growing my own vegetables on my new allotment.

Previous recessions have lasted around 15 months or so and then its back to normal, and the fact that we are posting on a forum means that at the very least we have internet access. Lets try and just direct our feet, to the sunny side of the street.

I should add that I did not have a small number of Wetherspoons IPAs at lunch time so I might be best ignored.
( browser still relating boring anecdotes into a void on, Fri 23 Jan 2009, 16:07, 7 replies)

Fuck the Credit Crunch
I'm more concerned by the acute Pussy Crunch.
(flynbo puts this one down to his misspelt youth, Fri 23 Jan 2009, 16:01, 3 replies)

Some anagrams
'crutch cinder' – i.e. the contents of my wallet

'cur chic trend' – This is what I am forced to adhere to.

Anyone got any better ones?
(powervator and NONE SHALL PASS, Fri 23 Jan 2009, 15:59, 4 replies)

Banks Huh
About a year ago i was in severe difficulties financially. I had been redundant a while and thus had seen my savings dwindle to nothing. I had managed to get a regular but not massively well paid job but was still struggling to pay the bills etc due to several outstanding loans and the like.

At the time i banked with the RBS and finding myself in difficulty approached them in the hopes of them cutting me some slack and maybe giving me some leeway on repayments etc.

I was told in no uncertain terms that the chances of the bank helping me in any way were around the same as me procurring employment fucking the queen mother. Despite my pleas they gleefully informed me that despite me being a loyal customer of many years standing and not missing a payment on my mortgage previous to this there was nothing these cunt monkeys were prepared to do.

Thats why its nice to see RBS dying a slow and hopefully painful death. Its just a pity the government will bail them out.

With the HSBC now. much better.
(andythepieman Is surfing the waves of indifference on, Fri 23 Jan 2009, 15:58, Reply)

When it comes to the crunch...
I'm O.K, I've pretty much always had shitty minimum wage jobs. I do however take great pleasure in teaching my more affluent chums the merits of Peacocks, T.J Hughes' & TK Maxx, the places where even tramps dare not tread! Welcome to poverty You learned bastards. Four years in Uni? Go & work it up yourself!
(Dr Fishfinger Want's to see a fat man give a tit wank, Fri 23 Jan 2009, 15:49, Reply)

short-term memory...
Fuckpig's post reminded me...

Ok, so a couple of banks that were doing some rather dodgy lending have gone tits up and suddenly we're gripped by panic.

But hang on a second, we didn't worry when Enron went under. Or Barings. Or BCCI. And does anyone remember the mass hysteria when Lloyds damn near went under in the early 1990s, wiping out half of their "Names" and almost taking the insurance industry with it? Nope, probably not.

Why is that, I wonder? Is it:
a) "Because it's MUCH WORSE THIS TIME, SO PANIC!"?

b) They were much smaller companies and didn't matter to the financial world?

or, c) we didn't have such fuck-witted, lowest-common-denominator courting media reporting so that halfwits who have zero understanding of economics didn't wade in and increase the wave of hysteria, whilst an incompetent government takes the opportunity to offlay blame for it's bad policy decisions onto the private sector, whilst raping the middle-classes for more revenue to plug the gaps in their floundering economic management strategy...?

I think I might go with...C
(Chad, Fri 23 Jan 2009, 15:17, 21 replies)

It's getting better and better...
So, sold house in Summer 07, and renting (our annual increase was £10/month), waiting for house prices to hit rock bottom.

Petrol under 90p/l is nice too, as expenses mileage rates for my 100mile/day round trip hasn't changed since last summer.
(MartinB9999, Fri 23 Jan 2009, 15:15, 1 reply)

the thing is....
this 'credit crunch' is just the next in a long line of the nation's grand list of
THINGS TO BE AFRAID OF
Yes,a few banks went bust but this sort of thing happens fairly regularly.I am allllmost old enough to remember the last 'credit crunch',which was almost a decade before this one.Roll back the clock to 1987 (remember black monday?),and then another decade or so when there was a crunch in the seventies...etcetera.Capitalism is cyclical.Shares go down as well as up.It is inherent in the nature of capitalism that companies will go down the pan - it happens.

If you're interested,here's a rundown of all the things since 1991 (that I can remember) that someone,somewhere, has told me to
BE AFRAID OF.
E-coli,BSE,MMR,Mobile phones ,Terrorism, MRSA, Terrorism ,H5N1, Terrorism, Bird Flu, Terrorism, Stock market Crash, Rampant Inflation, The Millennium Bug , The Conservatives, New Labour, A Fascist state, The Credit Crunch, The 'panopticon' , House Prices, Terrorism, terrorism and terrorism.
Have I ever paid a blind bit of notice?No.
Have I ever been affected by any of them?Well,not really...
(Fuckpig "That's not even a pound a midget.", Fri 23 Jan 2009, 15:01, 10 replies)

I don't have to queue for quite so long..

( NeeNoo, Fri 23 Jan 2009, 14:59, 6 replies)

unemployment
I just moved to America, before I arrived I was told it's impossible to find a job as everyone is looking right now. I have been looking for work since the beginning of the year, 3 weeks now. I'm not the most qualified person (just passed A-levels with DEE and only spent 2 years at college failing both years). With all this considered I thought it would be even harder for me to get a job.

So far I have had 1 offer of a job and a second one pending me passing a test this afternoon.

The secret? I dress smartly, I'm polite in interviews and answer the questions as best as I can. seems pretty obvious right? I have been to a couple of open interview days (turn up and you will get an interview) and I couldn't believe some of the people looking for work. They look like they have just crawled out of bed and walked straight into the job fair. One guy was even talking to another guy about how poorly organized the job fair was and how it was pointless even being there. I was sitting half way across the room and could hear him bad mouthing the company clear as day. Seriously did the guy expect the interviewer to even consider him with an attitude like that? Other people when they were being interviewed looked like they were still in bed. When being interviewed sit up straight, take the gum out of your mouth and try not to talk like you're talking to one of your "homies".
( bobzarkoff, Fri 23 Jan 2009, 14:52, 2 replies)

part of the problem
was the sudden push over the last few years that everyone has to get on the housing ladder, right now, right this minute.

well, it sounds awful to say it, but the harsh truth is that not everyone can afford to get on the housing ladder at right this minute. if you need to borrow 125%, unless you are in a career with a guaranteed salary hike (eg trainee - fully qualified solicitor), you cannot afford the house.

our private client team had loads of queries about the new stamp duty holiday. now yes, everybody wants to save a couple of grand, who the hell wouldn't. but for some people, it was literally the difference between buying or not buying. if £2k makes that difference to you, you cannot afford it and you will end up in trouble if forces beyond your control, like your job or the housing market, conspire against you. the kind of trouble where you lose your house, and the sale only covers a fraction of your debt, and you get sued for the balance plus interest up to TWELVE YEARS down the line.

which is what i warned my friends, who spunked out £285k on a 125% mortgage to live in a shithole in streatham, that is now worth about £205k, if they could sell it at all, that is. they'd been living rent free in his parents' flat before that; if they'd just gritted their teeth and saved up for a year, instead of having to buy somewhere right then and there, they'd have had a decent deposit, could have bought somewhere nicer on a normal sized mortgage, and wouldn't be in quite such a mess.

bloody irresponsible lending!
( rachelswipe with a fork, Fri 23 Jan 2009, 14:46, 18 replies)

the 125% mortgage...
Ok, so you see a house you like, say it's worth £200k. You could borrow £225,000 against it because "it's bound to go up in value, right?".

So, you sign the paperwork, get the cash and buy the place, along with £25k you piss up the wall on Plasma TVs, buying the entire catalogue of Ikea, etc.

So, the mortgage company own the place for as long as you owe them money (that's why they hold the deeds). But, they actually own the house, plus 25% which means that someone with no claim on your home actually mathematically owns more of it that you do - you own -25%, they own 0%, after all. Think about that for a second and then it will become obvious to even the most dedicated idiot that this is A Very Bad Idea....-
(Chad, Fri 23 Jan 2009, 14:34, 9 replies)

Can't beat a car boot sale.
I am pretty desperate for cash at the moment so last weekend I sorted out the attic and took a load of stuff to our local car boot sale.

I made loads of money and I even managed to sell the old beaten up stradi-wotsit violin that was kickin’ around up there for years and years that my Italian grandfather gave me. I got £20 for it.

Result!
(powervator and NONE SHALL PASS, Fri 23 Jan 2009, 14:25, 4 replies)

Credit crunch...
Yes, I dislike this term too. It seems to have been made up by the tabloids, then copied by the BBC and everyone else.
As I was reading through some of the other answers I thought "This global economic downturn (better than CC) hasn't really affected me." And just then I realised how it has.
I was due to get a new company car (Ooh! Boo-hoo, free car, hard life, etc. It's to replace the nasty 110k+ miles 4 year old citroen xsara. The lease company want to do it 'cos it'll be cheaper for them) This was canceled not so long ago because they couldn't afford the new cars.
"Not to worry," says they, "we will get you a nearly new car, better condition than what you're driving."
"Goody," says I, "where is it coming from?"
"From the people being made redundant," says they.
Apparently I'm seventh on the list for a replacement car from some poor engineer being made redundant. This makes me sad. And a little scared.
( gareth_alien will be human again at, Fri 23 Jan 2009, 14:17, 3 replies)

Whenever I have to visit my bank these days for any kind of meeting, I always add that i'm considering switching my ISA and share portfolio to their product, and would like a few leaflets. As a result, i'm usually offered a cup of tea and a five minute wait on the plush leather sofas reading the FT and feeling very self important, before I go in to grovel with the manager about increasing my student overdraft. Often they capitulate quickly to my demands in order to get to talking about my ISA, at which point i fob them off, take a few leaflets and promise to call. Works a charm, the greedy little monkeys; just need to make them think they're the ones in control.
(Roopy all is not what it seams, Fri 23 Jan 2009, 14:09, Reply)

Not really a funny, sorry
I, myself am doing okay so far into the credit crunch. Norway hasn't been too hard hit yet *knock on wood* and we're still at only a 3% unemployment rate. My fiancee earns enough to support us both so whatever I manage to bring in is an added bonus to the savings or fun money.

But I do worry about my family back in england. My eldest brother works two crappy jobs (security and life guarding) at the age of 28 when he's fully qualified and very talented at silversmithing. Mainly because his wife insists that the children (6 months and 2 years) cannot possibly spend three days a week in daycare so that she can work part time. Because obviously, it's the man's job to support the family. This worked ok before the financial crisis, now I worry that Chris doesn't sleep at all.. Witch.

My other brother is in the middle of an unfunded PhD, his teaching work just got cut to one day a week from three and he's struggling. Bah. My little sister is auditioning for a Masters in Leipzig, no idea where she'll find the money to do it now that her spare money goes on helping my PhD brother.

And my parents just have no money at all! They were surviving on the interest from their savings but now of course there is very little or no interest, so they're having to actually use their savings now. Bit crap, I feel helpless because I am currently not earning enough to support just one of them, let alone them all.

And to top it all off, I'm getting married here in Norway this summer so they all have to find the money to book flights out here! (admittedly not so expensive. 100 pounds each for a return). I feel terrible about it.
(darras jeg har en grevling i hodet. Grevling, grevlang, Fri 23 Jan 2009, 13:32, 5 replies)

Right boys 'n' girls, listen up.
I was born in Coventry.

I was actually born in a house on a 1958-9 built estate that my parents bought in 1959.The estate was built for the skilled men of the city (once upon a time Coventry was "the toolroom of the world"), it's a mixed development. No builder was allowed to build more than 20% of the houses so there's some variety in design. There's terraced, semis, detatched and bungalows, all mixed in. Loads of green spaces, trees, schools, shops and pubs.

I still live on the same estate, I bought my own house on it, my children grew up on it, they went to the local schools etc.

It was always easy to know how much your house was worth. The local rag used to produce a list of "Toolroom average" pay across the city. The terraced houses were a shade under two years worth of a skilled man's salary, the end of terraces about two years' worth and the detatched about two and a half years' worth.

When you needed a mortgage the banks knew how much you could afford and lent accordingly. I bought my house on my basic wage alone, without overtime etc, because we wanted children and I knew that if we bought including her wages, we could never afford it.

Today, if I was a toolmaker in Coventry, I'd have to be earning £77,000 a year to buy the same house.

Genuine question. Where did this massive price hike come from? The house is no bigger. It has no better amenities, it's not been encrusted with diamonds with hot and cold running nyphomaniacs in every room yet it's now three or more times a toolmaker's salary!

Lending became irresponsible. How can a bank lend 125% of an asset's market value, unless they're relying on a housing market bubble, THAT THEY THEMSELVES CREATED FFS!

They fucked up and we're bailing them out.

No hummus. Just remember, next time you see a banker, terminate with extreme prejudice. It's the only language they deserve.


Cunts.
(Captain Placid 24/7 ball gags, brownie mix and clown porn, Fri 23 Jan 2009, 13:29, 5 replies)

I've had to stop buying the services of whores.

( mike woz ere 7442200 & 7696970 getter, Fri 23 Jan 2009, 13:14, 6 replies)

Hard times indeed
I can't afford Bollinger Grand Annee anymore, I'm having to make do with non vintage.

For fuck sake when will this misery end?
(zebby wasting irony here on, Fri 23 Jan 2009, 12:56, 2 replies)

FREE Coffee & biscuits!
Now when I go to the bank I saunter over to the staff area and help myself to coffee & biscuits. When questioned I say "it's ok, I'm a shareholder".*

Thankyou Gordon Brown for making me a shareholder of my bank.


*May not have been implemented yet, but I'm thinking about it :)
(golddust QOTW now revolves around being a cunt, Fri 23 Jan 2009, 12:49, 1 reply)

I'm so hard up
I can't even afford to pay attention to this QOTW.
(oneinthepink is at your cervix m'lady, Fri 23 Jan 2009, 12:44, Reply)

Fired
My work has had to let me go due to the current economic climate. That and also because I turned up to work this morning dressed as a member of the black and white minstrels (How was I supposed to know that it was a day where a major client of ours was having a tour of the company).
(mon bison powered by magnets, Fri 23 Jan 2009, 12:42, Reply)

dumbasses, the lot of 'em..
I think the thing I object to most (aside from the slack-jawed twat running the country refusing to admit that it was his policies that allowed what would have been a minor wobble to become a total fucking disaster) is the term Credit Crunch.

We're in recession, or at least a period of low economic growth. Are we to honestly believe that there are Economics professors discussing the current situation between themselves using the term "Crunch"? Or is it the product of some spiky-haired media-cunt who is now clutching themself with glee at the prospect of hearing their bit of copy-writing repeated ad nauseum?

I also object to the stupid red-arrow graphics that spiral all over the screen before plunging vertically downwards. If an economy has slowed down over two-quarters, it hasn't dropped vertically, you twunts. It is this level of Jeremy-Kyle-onomics that means morons are running round like it's the end of the world and "confidence" in banking is shot. When, in reality, bankers should be shot. And anyone who honestly believes that lending more than the value of a house by securing it against that house is a good idea should not be touted as a "financial expert" by the tabloid and sensationalist TV media.

I am truly sorry for those being made redundant in Swindon, etc, but the honest truth is that the UK car industry had been raped by over-inflated pay rises and over-staffing many years ago (remember Red Robbo and his ransoming of the UK car market in the 1970s/80s?), so I think this is more a case of things that were already crap just finally falling over.

We have a PM who, out of arrogance in his belief that economic cycles don't apply to him, ignored any possibility that income can go dow as well as up. He has borrowed billions, taking us from a healthy growing economy in 97 to utter ruin now...his solution? Borrow more cash to bail out the City in order to get banks to lend moeny. Why? The government OWNs Nothern Rock, so why don't they bail out the geenral public by using the Nationalised bank they now own to lend money. This will increase trade, which in turn will stimulate the other (non-nationalised) banks to start pulling their heads out of their assess and get things sorted out.

The fact they are talking about giving bonuses to Northern Rock staff for their "hard work" (what hard work, they sat tight whilst WE paid to cover for their fuckups!)is a total piss-take and should be stopped, as it's just saying to the other banks "you can act as irresponsibly as you want and we'll bail you out" - in fact, I think that the government should guaranteeing the savings and investments of the general public directly via Northern Rock (or the Post Office) - you can transfer your account there and they will back it, no questions asked. Then they can just let the cocky bastards in the City rip each other apart and go to the wall, as at least the general public would be protected.

I really should run this country...
(Chad, Fri 23 Jan 2009, 12:41, 2 replies)

Hasn't affected me more like...
To set the scene, I owe no debts outside of friends 'n family. I rent and pay remarkadly low rent all things considered, my job is stable and funded for the next 3 years so pending gross stupidity or moving onto a better position I'm sorted.

And the best thing is I have a brain and a budgetting capacity so that I do not spend more than I can realistically afford.

The major way this R.E.C.E.S.S.I.O.N. effects me is to laugh (with my fellow B3tans) at those without this ability to budget and look at my friends who are also in the same situation of wondering how does this R.E.C.E.S.S.I.O.N. affect them due to having budgetting skills.

Anywho, the best part about 2009 is that I'm taking part in the Copenhagen 2009 Out! Games and while there do some serious sight seeing, am going to Amsterdam with some other friends for a mash up holiday and finally visiting some friends in China. All without incurring any debt as I'm saving up money in advance. Hell, I don't even have a credit card.

Do you think the government instead of bailing out banks they should be giving budgetting advice classes?

"No Timmeh, on your wage of £13,500 a year you canNOT afford a plasma screen Tv in a £500,000 house with a swimming pool"

"WAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!! I WANT IT I WANT IT!!!"

Heh

(Slight rant here)

Has anyone thought that the way in which banks offer Credit also slightly f**ked up? For example, as mentioned don't have any loans/credit cards etc. yet my credit rating is considered poor.

My friend however owes a ton of cash and is in debt up to his manicured eyebrows yet is considered an "excellent customer".

There is so much evidence to show that you are a bad spender and that you "need" credit but how comes there is no evidence to show the opposite? To show that you are responsible with your money?
(Helo, Fri 23 Jan 2009, 12:38, 9 replies)

That's gotta hurt
I recently realised that I can't really afford to spend the money I used to spend on going to see Southend play football, as I now live the opposite side of London, so the travel is too expensive (as well as the fact that it's now £25 to watch them - twenty five fucking quid to watch shitty third tier football, it's a digrace, in my day...[insert long rant about rip off football here])

Any-hoo

I still like my football fix if I’m at a loose end, so I started to walk down to my local non-league team some Saturday afternoons. A fiver to get in and no travel costs, luvverly.

A few weeks ago, I was standing about 10 yards to the side goal, on a slope, as the away team were coming towards me. The ball came to the forward who lined up a shot that he couldn't miss.

Except, being a shite non-league footballer, he did miss.

By about 10 yards.

It took me a second to realise I was about to get smacked square in the face by the ball, but I just about reacted in time to bend over and spin away.

I guess I kind of expected to still get smacked in the back of the head.

What I certainly didn't expect was to see the ball cannon straight into the face of the 10 year old boy standing behind me up the slope, forcing his hot dog so far into his mouth that Linda Lovelace would have been proud.

I also didn't mean to laugh while he bawled his eyes out.

And I didn't expect to be too scared to go back to the ground since after his Dad told me he didn't want to see my 'fucking face' again.

It's difficult to hide at a non league football ground.

I need something else cheap to do on Saturday afternoons.
( scarpe We Stole Bikes, Fri 23 Jan 2009, 12:36, 10 replies)

Crunch Goes the Weasel
Some of you may know (many may not care), but I’ve had a few issues with my Father in Law regarding money. We invested with him in the way of property a few years back, took out a loan for £25k for refurbishment, and let him get on with it. When his son decided we weren’t grateful enough for what they had done for us (not what we had done for them), I decided to sever that friendship. He was the best man at my wedding a few years before.
A few months ago, my FIL fell into a bit of trouble with his property development business, as you can imagine. With eleven BTL mortgages and 2 personal mortgages under his belt, he began to feel the crunch, as it were. Missus w4 and I decided it would be best if we took over the letting aspect of our property ourselves; to relieve him of the pressure of worrying about our property.
We were collecting rent of £480pcm on a mortgage requiring payments of £780pcm. FIL had been making up the difference, and he promised he would continue to do so. However, he refused to let us take over our house. As the house is quite far away from where we live, we decided to visit the house to see it’s state, and review the current let (surely we can get more rent money!). When we arrived, we discovered just how far the £25k went on our house. It bought us:
-a coat of paint
-a new fusebox
-nothing else.
Not too impressed, we were. We decided a calm rational discussion to review our investment was not the way to go, so my wife did yell and scream and gnash her teeth.
Daddy broke down and cried. Not an easy thing to watch.
He confessed to having most of his houses repossessed. He was living out of his car as he had no place to live. His wife was living abroad, on sabbatical, blissfully unaware of the horrible state of affairs. So what to do?
Remembering the kind, sage advice from fellow b3tans regarding money, father in laws, and karma in a previous QOTW, I told him he was not allowed to sleep in his car, he must now sleep in our flat. From there, he could have a bit of a break, get himself on his feet, and begin to work his way through his problems.
He is now in a bad state. He is on antidepressants, and is seeking benefits. He has found an old caravan, and him and his wife have moved into it. They are both in their late fifties. He went from driving a Lexus and owning lots of houses, to living in a £200 caravan in this cold weather. He’s a broken man.
His son, who bragged about being responsible for making the development company so great? He’s disappeared, and will not offer any help to his family. In fact, he whines that if he goes bankrupt, he’ll never get to immigrate to Australia. He refuses to even look for a job, as he is ‘above’ working for other people. He’s 26.
So the ‘crunch’ has been tough on my family. Luckily, I have a good solid steady job that pays well and allows me to support my uni-attending wife, my cat, and my FIL; pays my rent and my mortgage, and lets me have a curry once in a while. Not so luckily, it has torn my wife’s family apart.
Sorry for lack of funnies.
I know! What’s black and white and black and white and black and white?
A penguin rolling down the hill
(w4I4q1O1 was hard at work on, Fri 23 Jan 2009, 12:32, Reply)

mixed blessings..
Just filed the tax return for last financial year having sorted through all the paperwork and it's done, profit was down on the year before...boo


Got a tax refund of £1500 though yay
(bluehamster, Fri 23 Jan 2009, 12:28, Reply)

I'm gonna
knickname my cock 'credit crunch'.

Then I'll spend my nights thinking of new and interesting ways to beat the credit crunch.
( SpankyHanky, Fri 23 Jan 2009, 12:14, 1 reply)

Sweety Trickery
The credit crunch is a bitch.

Now i can't afford to buy any sweets i have to find a cheaper alternative to offer kids to get into my car (A big empty box with a ribbon does the trick).
(NuffMuff fucks shrubbery, Fri 23 Jan 2009, 12:10, 5 replies)