Right, that's dead.
So, apart from gloating over the fact that a right wing think tank is recommending that the government enforces gentrification of the nice bits of the country, are any of you lot looking forward to the Paralympics?

Have any of you got tickets to see anything?

Do you think that, given Channel 4's woeful record on sports coverage, their pathetic attempts will cause widespread public condemnation?
(Bazongaloid, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 12:51, 129 replies, latest was 13 years ago)

I don't see why gentrification is such a bad thing.
I haven't got tickets for anything but I'm going to watch some of the wheelchair rugby.
And Channel 4's Cricket coverage was pretty good wasn't it?
(PsychoChomp, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 12:55, Reply)

I like the idea of wheelchair rugby
but I'm not sure how it works.
( b3th Not shit. Not mod., Mon 20 Aug 2012, 12:59, Reply)

They smash the shit out of each other. It's brutal but awesome.
They also armour their wheelchairs
(PsychoChomp, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:00, Reply)

Cool.
Sounds fun.
( b3th Not shit. Not mod., Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:02, Reply)

This sort of thing happens a lot
www.zimbio.com/pictures/vQP0rZtr3ic/Paralympics+Day+6+Wheelchair+Rugby/8zQO5CRU-6j/Ryley+Batt
(PsychoChomp, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:04, Reply)

that's not even a rugby ball
fucking divs
( Light In Chains maker of the ikea sofa, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:11, Reply)

what with spikes and that?

( mark morrisons prison shoes I love Willie, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:03, Reply)

Nah, just metal plates and bars.
If only they had spikes.
(PsychoChomp, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:05, Reply)

how the fuck does a scrum work?
still, no fear of collapsing it, not like they can fuck themselves up too much more.
( mark morrisons prison shoes I love Willie, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:06, Reply)

I don't think there is a scrum... it's not exactly the same rules as rugby.

(PsychoChomp, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:08, Reply)

how dare they call it rugby!
fucking cyborgs. THIS FAR AND NO FURTHER!!!
( mark morrisons prison shoes I love Willie, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:11, Reply)

When they're in a ruck, what do they do
how are they supposed to stamp on each other?
( Kroney, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:10, Reply)

bunny hops?

( mark morrisons prison shoes I love Willie, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:13, Reply)

OK, so say it's League rules (I think) where instead of mauling
they just roll the ball back behind them for a teammate. How does that work, then? What if it gets tangled in their wheels? What if their legs don't work.

It doesn't sound very well thought through, mumps.
( Kroney, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:16, Reply)

Hey, keep me out of their wheels.

( tangledupinblue hairy badge with moving eyes, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:43, Reply)

I watched some the other day, it's shit and pointless
Why don't these people just roll over and die like nature intended?
( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:25, Reply)

I had to google what that means.
No, no tickets, and probably yes. CHannel four is a bit rubbish from memory.
(Poppet some assembly required., Mon 20 Aug 2012, 12:57, Reply)

I've heard that the events in the paralympics will be decided by viewer votes rather than sporting merit.
I expect the one with tourettes to win the high dive.

"Here comes the plucky British lad now. He steadies himself on the edge of the board, prepares to lauch himself into a triple somersault with pike and half twist, and..."

"Piss cunt waaaaaaaaaaaaaaank" *splash*

"Oh, faultless delivery there."
( b3th Not shit. Not mod., Mon 20 Aug 2012, 12:59, Reply)

no pfft, cause, hahahahaha, the tickets teeheehee cost an lolololol arm and a leg!!!!
ROFLCOPTER!!!!!
( mark morrisons prison shoes I love Willie, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:02, Reply)

Oh man, I totaly didn't see that one coming.

(Bazongaloid, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:10, Reply)

No.
No.
No idea.
( tangledupinblue hairy badge with moving eyes, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:13, Reply)

A worthwhile contribution, I'm sure you'll agree.

( tangledupinblue hairy badge with moving eyes, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:14, Reply)

I hope you got what you needed at the shops.

(Bazongaloid, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:20, Reply)

Thanks, bro - all our nappy and paneer needs are now taken care of!

( tangledupinblue hairy badge with moving eyes, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:22, Reply)

You use disposable nappies and you call yourself a WOMAD prick?

( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:24, Reply)

I like to go part way towards assuaging my conscience
By getting some eco-nappies or some shit.
( tangledupinblue hairy badge with moving eyes, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:25, Reply)

Although what little bit of the planet I saved by buying them, has now been destroyed by me driving to the shops.

( tangledupinblue hairy badge with moving eyes, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:26, Reply)

Babies love the feel of fresh straw against their buttocks

( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:27, Reply)

What nappies do you use?

(Bazongaloid, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:27, Reply)

Pampers, they seem to give the best fit

( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:28, Reply)

This nappy subthread is the best part of this whole thread.

( tangledupinblue hairy badge with moving eyes, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:32, Reply)

I agree; we tried own brand ones, but got too much leakage so went back to Pampers, mini ape is on size 4 now

( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:34, Reply)

18 months of reusabales on catfaceceilidhbaby
and then a move to Lidl's own brand nappies which are cheap and rather good.

There. I am so proud of my contribution to the nappy subthread.
( crackhouseceilidhband Fuck off back to Mumsnet, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:02, Reply)

What is the most absorbant substance known to man?
Why Cherokee hair, of course.
( tangledupinblue hairy badge with moving eyes, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:28, Reply)

You know when it's really, really heavy flow.
I mean, you know that scene in the Shining when the lift doors open ...
(Bazongaloid, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:29, Reply)

you wear eco nappies when your period is really heavy?

( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:33, Reply)

MOOOOOOOOOOOONCUUUUUUUUUP.com

( crackhouseceilidhband Fuck off back to Mumsnet, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:03, Reply)

Poor people will be happier if they live with people like them
i care not one jot for the paralolympics

I won't be watching so don't care
( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:23, Reply)

That was the exact argument that the guy from policy exchange made this morning
"People in social housing are poor and therefore they don't want to live in nice places, because the supermarkets in nice places are too expensive for them. They should all fuck off to the slums where they build Aldis and Lidls"
(Bazongaloid, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:27, Reply)

God forbid we have someone who doesn't own an Aga
living in Kensington, what?

/The problem is that in a remarkably rare occurance, I can see both sides of the argument with this one. However, since it's a right-wing think tank proposing it I'm going to have to hate it.
( the mighty badger Aphrodite, on a bar stool, by your side, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:30, Reply)

There is no point in a housing scheme paying huge rents for people to live in very expensive areas
it's a waste and will actually prevent other scroungers getting a free house. the lefties should love it.
( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:31, Reply)

They aren't paying rents though are they you retard.
The whole point of this is that the houses are owned by the government, which is why they are proposing selling them and making a profit.
(Bazongaloid, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:34, Reply)

That, and social cleansing.

( the mighty badger Aphrodite, on a bar stool, by your side, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:35, Reply)

Are you saying that you would ratehr leeave a family out on the street in the pissing rain
than move a family to more reasonable and appropriate accomodation thus freeing up some capital? Seems a bit cruel for a hand ringer like yourself
( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:36, Reply)

because, like many other things, it really is as simple as that.
no, really.
( the mighty badger Aphrodite, on a bar stool, by your side, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:37, Reply)

Of course not. the point I'm making is that the priciple is sound
Impementaion is unfortunately another issue
( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:39, Reply)

No, the principle is not sound.
The idea has some merit, but is not without problems.
(Bazongaloid, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:41, Reply)

Hey, in my book Mr. Belding is well sound

( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:48, Reply)

I don't think I'd go as far as to say the principle is sound
The principle is the problem, really. As in, not thought through. The "hard aspects" ie the pure financial transation itself, is eminently sensible. But the reality is that the associated costs (both social and financial) would probably be huge.
( the mighty badger Aphrodite, on a bar stool, by your side, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:50, Reply)

Those aren't the only 2 options though.

(Bazongaloid, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:40, Reply)

Hence why we should bring back workhouses

( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:47, Reply)

I don't think that's what they are talking about.
This isn't councils paying private landlords to house tenants.

This is about council-owned properties. They don't cost high rents regardless of where they are, because the councils own them. This is about selling property that might be worth shitloads because of its location and using the money to build or buy more property in cheaper areas.

Like many of these ideas, it has some merit, but some really fucking stupid aspects, too.
( the mighty badger Aphrodite, on a bar stool, by your side, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:34, Reply)

As Chompy argued, in principle selling 1 house in street A to build 4 in Street B is a good idea
it's just that Street A is in a nice area, but Street B is 50 miles away and in the fucking horrendous place and anyone living there will be forever condemned to a shit life with no prospects because although they are happy to build a million flats on Street B, they aren't willing to provide enough schools, hospitals or general transport infrastructure to support Street B.
(Bazongaloid, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:37, Reply)

Fuck 'em, they should be happy they aren't left out on the street

( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:38, Reply)

Plus street A no longer has any element of social structure or variation
as everybody living on it is a fucking stockbroker.
( the mighty badger Aphrodite, on a bar stool, by your side, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:39, Reply)

street A will have a mixture of middle class people from a variety of socio-economic backgrounds
is what you meant to say
( Light In Chains maker of the ikea sofa, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:43, Reply)

Sorry, yeah.

( the mighty badger Aphrodite, on a bar stool, by your side, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:45, Reply)

See Al, right here is a sensible and well thought out response
very different to your mung bean spitting tirade of frothy middle class guilt.
( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:37, Reply)

I don't really see the stupid aspects
mainly because i don't really believe there is a pure reason why two identical properties in the same town can have a 50% price difference.
(PsychoChomp, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:39, Reply)

Location innit
If you are going to get stabbed everyday outside one house then it will be less attractive to a buyer.
( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:40, Reply)

It's not a matter of faith as to whether or not houses have a price difference
it simply "is".
(Bazongaloid, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:41, Reply)

Too many estate agents are non-believers, that's all.

( tangledupinblue hairy badge with moving eyes, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:42, Reply)

No pure reason except for the fact that it's demonstrably true in almost every single town in the UK?

The "fucking stupid" aspects are the ones Al mentions above. You can't achieve what you're talking about by moving someone around the corner, it would be miles away. Different schools, no social mix any more, etc, etc. It would work if you were selling a property that was valuable to build something literally round the corner in the same area, but we tried that 50 years ago. Sell housing stock to build inner-city high rises. they definitely worked absolutely brilliantly and there's been no problems at all assoicated with that, wouldn't you agree?
( the mighty badger Aphrodite, on a bar stool, by your side, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:44, Reply)

I know it's true, but I think it's a big load of bollocks. My current flat and my old flat have a £20,000 difference.
And they're identical and too close to even smoke a fag between the two.

My assumptions on how it would work if it was managed well would be something like this.
Sell houses on street A as they're empty in expensive streets. Do them up a little sell them for a profit
Spend that building new houses on vacant land or derelict sites B.
Now the council has a larger stock of housing but with the same overall value. Keep doing that with the assumption that selling at a profit to build more stock is the way you'll do it.
Eventually you have a large financial incentive to increase the house values of sites B, so refurbishing a school or playground in a bad area, subsidising bus routes street cleaning and policing in those areas starts making more economic sense.

But that means it'll have to be run correctly for years...
(PsychoChomp, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:58, Reply)

Which we can't do. Because our political system has no incentive for longtermism.
And that still doesn't change the fact that it's retrospective - you're moving families from nice areas to shit areas with the promise that the area will get better in X years time.

moving people from a good area to a bad one will also most likely decrease the chances of stuff like the children doing well at school, thus perpetuating those family through multiple generations of poverty etc etc
( the mighty badger Aphrodite, on a bar stool, by your side, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:02, Reply)

You're not moving people, you're waiting for the current occupiers to either die
or move out. And replacing them with new council tennants who are currently on a waiting list or in hostels or something.
If it was an eviction or relocation style thing I'd be dead against it.
(PsychoChomp, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:04, Reply)

It will turn into one, though.
Because there will be pressure for the results to be seen more quickly.
( the mighty badger Aphrodite, on a bar stool, by your side, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:06, Reply)

That is the thing.
Over 20 to 30 years you could change the face of the social housing in a council by proper property managment and smart manipulation of the market.
However they won't, because a council doesn't think on those timescales.
It's ridiculous as well because lets face it any councils property portfolio is probably their biggest asset if they were more flexible with it, they could make more money.
(PsychoChomp, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:10, Reply)

Also aga's are shit

( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:33, Reply)

and the first sentence was looking so promising...

( rachelswipe with a fork, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:31, Reply)

Hello Swipe,
were you at some sort of festival this weekend?
(Bazongaloid, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:32, Reply)

aye, i went to V
just for the day though. i am not someone who likes tents, which will not surprise you.

really fucked off, whilst i am whining - was meant to be in new york, got told a couple of weeks ago i couldn't go because of urgent work thing. fair enough, that's life. except that work thing settled late fri afternoon. so i missed NY. humph.
( rachelswipe with a fork, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:33, Reply)

I heard it was because that they were hot, sweaty and cramped with too many people inside them
and this reminded you too much of your vagina.
(Bazongaloid, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:34, Reply)

yeah, there are too many cocks in tents
oh.
( rachelswipe with a fork, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:38, Reply)

You looked very happy. And your hair seems to have returned to a normal colour.

(Bazongaloid, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:41, Reply)

it was a lovely sunny day
ha, it had neon pink gel in it for the hen-do pics. perhaps this was not immediately apparent.
( rachelswipe with a fork, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:42, Reply)

That's a shame. New York is a great place to go to.
I really, really like American Pale Ales.
(Bazongaloid, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:36, Reply)

Sounds reasonable
These people want a weatherspoons not an itlian deli, they want bus shelters they can piss in not scultures of local heros, they want to be able to loot Sports Direct not Fortnum and Mason.
( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:30, Reply)

"Poor people will be happier if they live with people like them"
Bollocks.

They did this in the 50's and the result was Basildon. I've never seen a fucker even crack a smile there.
( scarpe We Stole Bikes, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:50, Reply)

The proper gentry are only too happy to have the working classes living amongst them.
In the attic, above the stables, in the lodge. It's the new class of property greedy cunts who despise the workers. Oh no, we can't let a poor person (one without a Range Rover) anywhere near us. It might make the value of our property fall by 2p. Cunts, the lot of them. Who's going to char for them and cut their grass? Not me, I'm far too lazy.
( Bartleby A dead man on vacation, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:35, Reply)

This is (sort of) a very good point
If your affordable housing is too far from anywhere no-one in it will be working, because it'll cost them too much to travel to work and they'll be better off on benefits.
(localboy purveyor of pisspoor puns, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 13:58, Reply)

More importantly than all of this shit
I'm drinking a can of Diet Lilt. Does this make me gay?
( Kroney, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:07, Reply)

no, I'm afraid it's being repeatedly penetrated by sailors for pennies
that makes you gay.
( the mighty badger Aphrodite, on a bar stool, by your side, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:08, Reply)

Oh ok, that's alright then.
It's just I've got five more cans to get through and I didn't want to end up like some sort of superfag.
( Kroney, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:14, Reply)

you should be more concerned with it's links to vascular events and diabetes

( Light In Chains maker of the ikea sofa, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:17, Reply)

Nah, that'll be alright.

( Kroney, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:22, Reply)

I didn't even know you could get Diet Lilt.
I haven't had a Lilt in years. I used to really like Lilt. It was a "totally tropical taste"
(Bazongaloid, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:13, Reply)

Well, it's called "Lilt Zero"
but it's basically the same deal.
( Kroney, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:14, Reply)

Tastes like stomach acid.

(PsychoChomp, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:14, Reply)

I like lilt a lot

( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:39, Reply)

they still make it?
blimey
( rachelswipe with a fork, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:42, Reply)

no
your genes and mincing manner make you gay
( rachelswipe with a fork, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:31, Reply)

First time I see you today
and you insult me.
( Kroney, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:32, Reply)

it looked dead on here earlier
so i did some work instead.

client has leak on ceiling. the stain looks EXACTLY like a cock. i have been laughing for about 10 mins.
( rachelswipe with a fork, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:33, Reply)

And to think, out of the two of us
*you're* the grown-up.

How was V?
( Kroney, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:35, Reply)

It was gash, because it was 'V'

( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:38, Reply)

it was drinking in the sunshine with mates
and laughing at how out of tune poor old ian brown was. not that he seemed to care, mind.
( rachelswipe with a fork, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:40, Reply)

I hope you threw some piss at Cher Lloyd

( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:43, Reply)

no, i showed my disdain by refusing to go anywhere near her
i'd prefer to stand in the piss-stinking toilet queue than see her.
( rachelswipe with a fork, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:44, Reply)

More reasons why my landfill mining buisness is worth investing in
www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2012/aug/20/rare-earth-metals-resources-landfill-waste
(PsychoChomp, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:24, Reply)

Hi all
Can't be bothered to read through so I don't know if there’s a similar answer, but I have been thinking about going to the Polympics, just to see the Olympic park, last time I went there it was a building site.
( hartley hare Just some prick who thinks it doesn't apply to him, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:33, Reply)

what have you been doing to dozer, eh?

( rachelswipe with a fork, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:46, Reply)

Surely "what's Dozer been doing to his ties" would be more pertinant.

(Bazongaloid, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:54, Reply)

Also, check out the popular page

(Bazongaloid, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:55, Reply)

the ode to Hercules, is brilliant BTW

( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:55, Reply)

Awww fanks Nakers.

(Bazongaloid, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:58, Reply)

You can be my wing man anytime

(Bazongaloid, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:59, Reply)

bullshit
you can be mine
( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:59, Reply)

get a room you two lovebirds

( rachelswipe with a fork, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 15:01, Reply)

Ah, you've lost that lovin' feeling

( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 15:02, Reply)

i just know i can't compete with al's meaty man loving

( rachelswipe with a fork, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 15:04, Reply)

oh
oh blimey

that may be the most popular comment the popular board has ever seen... is dozer 2.0-ing you now?

i want to feel v sorry for hercules, but i just don't like hamsters. they irritate me.
( rachelswipe with a fork, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:56, Reply)

Yes. But he's seen it.

(Bazongaloid, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:58, Reply)

how do you know?

( rachelswipe with a fork, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 14:59, Reply)

If you read the whole thread that comes from you see a reply from him at the bottom.
Unless he deleted it.
(Bazongaloid, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 15:02, Reply)

nothing from him on there

( rachelswipe with a fork, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 15:04, Reply)

Has he ignored you too?


EDIT

www.b3ta.com/questions/offtopic/post1707842

This post. If you can't see it, he hates you.
(Bazongaloid, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 15:05, Reply)

i can see that
phew. i wouldn't want to be hated.
( rachelswipe with a fork, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 15:09, Reply)

trip to kfc for pd

( Light In Chains maker of the ikea sofa, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 15:02, Reply)

to cover it in cheese and serve it with fries?

( rachelswipe with a fork, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 15:04, Reply)

why must the death of a pet be met with such beastly mockery
people have feelings you know
( Light In Chains maker of the ikea sofa, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 15:06, Reply)

i wouldn't mind a bird or a dog or a goldfish
but hamsters? rodents are not pets. they are rodents.
( rachelswipe with a fork, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 15:09, Reply)

i don't think birds should be pets, seesm cruel to coop them up

( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 15:11, Reply)

dogs have a nonchalance about them when they lick up their balls and arse that rodents just can't replicate

( Light In Chains maker of the ikea sofa, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 15:12, Reply)

this is almost poetic in its majesty

( rachelswipe with a fork, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 15:20, Reply)

I stopped playing his game.
So he put me 0n 2.0
( hartley hare Just some prick who thinks it doesn't apply to him, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 15:08, Reply)

2.0 is for those who lack the courage of their own convictions

( rachelswipe with a fork, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 15:10, Reply)

All a bit silly really

( hartley hare Just some prick who thinks it doesn't apply to him, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 15:20, Reply)

I've started a new thread, although it's a bit shit, soz

( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Mon 20 Aug 2012, 15:10, Reply)