Stupid arguments
I am currently engaged in the most ridiculous argument with the cunts who designed our website. The 'customers' list report includes people who haveen't purchased ie they ARE NOT BY ANY DEFINITION CUSTOMERS. To me, this means the report is wrong: the prick actually stated 'you do not have to make an order to become a customer'. I am reduced to sending him links to dictionary sites.

What was the last stupid argument you had? Did you win? Were there no winners?

I'm glad that Kroney and his moth bride never argue and that is why he is happy to dedicate every single day of the rest of his life to her. A happy tale for us all.
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 11:47, 145 replies, latest was 12 years ago)

He's a "customer" of the website, but not of your buisness.

(PsychoChomp, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 11:48, Reply)

What custom have they recieved?

( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 11:51, Reply)

From wikipedia's page
A customer (also known as a client, buyer, or purchaser) is the recipient of a good, service, product, or idea, obtained from a seller, vendor, or supplier for a monetary or other valuable consideration.

They've recieved the service of viewing your website, looked at your product ideas. They've provided you with (I assume) contact details or at the very least let you download cookies to monitor their browsing habits.
(PsychoChomp, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 11:54, Reply)

Nah I'm not buying that.
Much like these 'customers' of mine LOL

They're not clients, buyers or purchasers.

If you walked in and out of a shop without making a purchase are you one of their customers?
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 11:59, Reply)

Not disagreeing with you entirely
but that's not a great example. If you wanted to know the number of customers in a shop at any time, surely you'd just count the people in there that aren't staff, regardless of whether they had actually bought anything?
( the mighty badger Aphrodite, on a bar stool, by your side, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:06, Reply)

You've something of a point here yourself.
But I have a report which supposedly identifies subscribers/non-subscribers and 'customers' but I am being told they're all customers and there's no way of telling them apart (unless I fucking pay for a new report to be designed). The patronising prick actually called me to show me how to check an individual record to see if there's an order history, the suggestion being that perhaps I could do this for about 30,000 records, manually.
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:10, Reply)

Can't you just put the data in Excel
And do a lookup?
( JeffTheDogFucker Can you dig it?, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:12, Reply)

The quick answer is 'no', mate.
I cannot access all the data.
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:16, Reply)

Well you're fucked then aren't you.

( JeffTheDogFucker Can you dig it?, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:21, Reply)

Excellent technical answer here.

( Fucking hell Jeff I am not a robot, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:22, Reply)

This additional detail does indeed prove
that he is a fucking prick. I concur.
( the mighty badger Aphrodite, on a bar stool, by your side, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:13, Reply)

What type of database is it and what do you use to pull your reports?
I'll make you a new report for a tenner.
(PsychoChomp, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:13, Reply)

(if I have the software here)

(PsychoChomp, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:13, Reply)

Pricing yourself out of the market there.

( tangledupinblue hairy badge with moving eyes, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:13, Reply)

rofflecopters

( the mighty badger Aphrodite, on a bar stool, by your side, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:14, Reply)

Adding a filter in SQL and changing the headers from "customers" to "people who may or may not have recieved custom"
will take me about 5 mins.
(PsychoChomp, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:17, Reply)

I'm not questioning your ability to do it, I'm questioning his ability to pay you a tenner.

( tangledupinblue hairy badge with moving eyes, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:19, Reply)

:o(

( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:20, Reply)

He can send me a set of shelves or whatever the fuck he sells instead.

(PsychoChomp, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:22, Reply)

The problem is that there isn't an export from this site with all the relevant information in it, from which it could be sorted.
It's all custom stuff: for you to extract it you'd need access to parts of the back end of the site which we cannot get into - annoying as fuck because if we could it would be easy. These wankers want paying to give me information I should be able to get in an instant.
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:19, Reply)

What is the point in having this information if you can't access it?
I think you need to get someone else to set up your website.
( tangledupinblue hairy badge with moving eyes, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:23, Reply)

I think you are entirely correct.

( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:33, Reply)

So the report you're getting is direct from a webpage?
If you don't have access to the raw data just go back saying "I won't pay for a report to be designed just set up a straight data export to be sent over an ftp to be stored and analysed locally"
Even if they're hosting the whole thing they should probably accept that the data is owned by your company and it's up to you what you do with it.
(PsychoChomp, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:27, Reply)

I will try this.
Thanks a lot.
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:31, Reply)

You'll need to do a risk assesment about storing the data though.
We will password protect the data, encrypt the files, not browse porn on the servers, keep antivirus up to date. Review this in three months. That sort of thing.
(PsychoChomp, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:40, Reply)

Gotcha

( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:48, Reply)

Wait, wait, back up there...
"NOT browse porn"??
Sounds rubbish.
( tangledupinblue hairy badge with moving eyes, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:50, Reply)

Sounds to me like you're just being a lazy prick, Monty.

( Kroney, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:24, Reply)

I read this as 'AAAARRGRGRGRHHH IT'S A MOTH!!!!!'

( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:32, Reply)

I read this as "Waaaaaah, a company I paid to do a specific job won't do something I didn't pay them for for free"

( Kroney, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:40, Reply)

So you are siding with the unhelpful IT guys here?

( tangledupinblue hairy badge with moving eyes, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:44, Reply)

Speaking as an unhelpful IT guy
I feel it'd be betraying my people to adopt a different stance.
( Kroney, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:46, Reply)

Is that stance 'cowering, shaking, in a corner because a harmless insect is in the room'?

( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:47, Reply)

Haha fuck you

( Kroney, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:55, Reply)

What valuable consideration have they exchanged this service for?

( Kroney, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 11:59, Reply)

If you have their details,
their details so that you can tirelessly spam the fuck out of them
( the mighty badger Aphrodite, on a bar stool, by your side, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:04, Reply)

I'm by no means an expert
but I've always assumed that "custom" was a knowing contract by both parties to exchange goods/services for currency/commodities.

Personally, and this is only a personal opinion, I wouldn't have thought that cookies and contact details count. You don't have an option over cookies aside from avoiding the website altogether and, unless they've bought something or signed up for something, you shouldn't have their contact details.
( Kroney, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:07, Reply)

I was not disputing this particularly
I was just subtly moaning about spam.
( the mighty badger Aphrodite, on a bar stool, by your side, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:09, Reply)

I like the story about the email spammer
whose house address was discovered by internet people and they started signing him up for physical junk mail.

He tried to get a court injunction and the judge ruled "fuck you, I hate email spam".
( Kroney, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:11, Reply)

i hardly think, visiting a website makes you a customer if you have not at least attempted to buy something

( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 11:59, Reply)

No custom = not a customer.
Simple really.
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:03, Reply)

This is true, but I think what your web monkey is looking at are lost potential customers.
Analysis of 'dropped carts' is used to try to improve sales.
( tangledupinblue hairy badge with moving eyes, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:05, Reply)

c f

Pewww, open the window!!!!!!
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:07, Reply)

That's what I want to look at too.
I want a list of the cunts' email addresses. Nothing earth-shattering.
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:13, Reply)

A list of email addresses is a bit of a ballache because of Information governance to be honest.

(PsychoChomp, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:16, Reply)

But we have the email addresses anyway.
All I need to do is run a match of that list against one of all our purchasers and subtract one from the other.
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:39, Reply)

, visiting a website makes you a customer if you have not at least attempted to buy something
( tangledupinblue hairy badge with moving eyes, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:03, Reply)

I do lack a brain filter it's true

( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:05, Reply)

With a stupid customer, who complained that we'd followed his instruction.
I say 'argument', I mean that whilst the account manager was talking to the guy to get the information, my Manager and I were holding up signs saying 'Cunt' and 'Wanker'.

It helps.
( Agnostic Antichrist Baltimora, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 11:51, Reply)

I've been arguing with a client for 18 months
No matter waht analysis I put in front of them, no matter what data I use they just say they don't believe it. It's like arguing with a woman.
( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 11:53, Reply)

Is that why I often can't find what I'm looking for in the supermarket?

( tangledupinblue hairy badge with moving eyes, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 11:54, Reply)

Thanks "The Edge"

( sporters I’m sincerely gratitude to you, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 11:55, Reply)

that's because you're a spastic

( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 11:59, Reply)

You'd know

( sporters I’m sincerely gratitude to you, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:01, Reply)

Yeah takes one to know one!



no...wait
( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:02, Reply)

You need better analysis
or to understand it.
(PsychoChomp, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 11:54, Reply)

I suppose a public sector jobsworth is just the person to do that?

( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 11:58, Reply)

If I couldn't explain something in 18 months, well a week to be honest. I'd consider myself a failure.

(PsychoChomp, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:06, Reply)

Yeah, you're doing that thing where you read what you want to read not what's there
I'd have thought someone with an eye for accurate data input would be more careful, oh well I guess that's why they're letting you go.
( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:24, Reply)

I read exactly what you meant.
But your assumption that it is the clients fault is wrong.
If they don't believe the raw data then you need to prove to them that the collection method is sound.
If they don't understand the analysis, then you need to be clear about the methodology and limit your predictions to things which can be tested for accuracy when they come about.
If it's their inbuilt predjudice or assumptions then you need to carefully challenge that by using predictions based on those assumptions that are proved wrong in the data.
(PsychoChomp, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:34, Reply)

Perhaps they are assuming that he is a bent spastic?

( tangledupinblue hairy badge with moving eyes, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:35, Reply)

We have done all of that and all other areas of that business are engaged and happy
this is historical stubborness, nothing else.
( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:37, Reply)

ZING!

(dozers, do fuck off ur a nob m8, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:34, Reply)

I forget who said it
but the phrase "you don't need common sense when you've got rules" comes to mind.
(localboy purveyor of pisspoor puns, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 11:57, Reply)

Clarkson in The Sun
Well, he was quoting an American -

"A few years ago, I was told by a cheerily daft Florida policeman that you don't need common sense when you've got rules. And he absolutely could not see he'd got that completely the wrong way round."
( The Light in Chains don't touch the Pope's boner, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 13:22, Reply)

I've no idea what the last stupid argument I had was
but it was definitely on here.
( the mighty badger Aphrodite, on a bar stool, by your side, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:08, Reply)

The last truly stupid argument I had was with the ex.

( Kroney, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:09, Reply)

Oh come on, every time CQ is on here you have one with him.

( tangledupinblue hairy badge with moving eyes, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:10, Reply)

Those are merely petty and slightly stupid.

( Kroney, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:12, Reply)

JUST LIKE CQ!!!

( tangledupinblue hairy badge with moving eyes, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:14, Reply)

Whatever else I think of the man, I don't think he's stupid.

( Kroney, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:16, Reply)

hang on, you texted me what you thought of him yesterday...
... totally hot.... would smoke that like an imported cocktail fag.... want to ride his face til dawn?
( rachelswipe with a fork, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 13:06, Reply)

The tips of his moustache tickle my balls.

( Kroney, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 13:09, Reply)

actually Monts, as a marketer I would agree with them.
Any interaction with your company makes them a customer.
(dozers, do fuck off ur a nob m8, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:20, Reply)

B.U.L.L.S.H.I.T.
A consumer is only a customer when they transact with an individual or organisation for a product or service.
( Fucking hell Jeff I am not a robot, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:25, Reply)

visiting the website is part of the customer journey
Customer service applies from when they set foot in the shop and then on past the transactional stage.

What browsers don't buy is just as important as what they do buy.
(dozers, do fuck off ur a nob m8, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:31, Reply)

You need to listen to the notes he's NOT playing

( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:33, Reply)

Marketing jazz.

(dozers, do fuck off ur a nob m8, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:35, Reply)

customer journey user experience.

FFS.
( Fucking hell Jeff I am not a robot, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:37, Reply)

customer journey
User experience is discrete. Customer journey is ongoing.

Relational vs transactional etc etc.
(dozers, do fuck off ur a nob m8, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:40, Reply)

Wrong.

( Fucking hell Jeff I am not a robot, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:41, Reply)

so you don't think that a service should be provided unless a person has paid in some way?
Providing a service to someone implies a customer relationship.
(dozers, do fuck off ur a nob m8, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:45, Reply)

You'd make a rubbish prostitute,
for several reasons.
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:46, Reply)

haha

( rachelswipe with a fork, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 13:06, Reply)

You make it sound like the website's a fucking ashram.

( Kroney, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:38, Reply)

He's making himself sound like an ignorant tit.
Which he is.
( Fucking hell Jeff I am not a robot, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:40, Reply)

I'll be honest
I'm all at sea with all this shitty red braces jargon.
( Kroney, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:42, Reply)

So is he.

( Fucking hell Jeff I am not a robot, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:43, Reply)

Best symantics based thread EVER!

( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:25, Reply)

Even with the edit you've failed to spell it correctly.

( tangledupinblue hairy badge with moving eyes, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:32, Reply)

meh, close enough

( Naked Ape call me Caitlyn, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:33, Reply)

I can't see any conversation about enterprise back-up solutions in this thread.
NERD HUMOUR
( Kroney, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:38, Reply)

Norton single one

(localboy purveyor of pisspoor puns, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:39, Reply)

Excellent (Backup) Exec(ution)

( sporters I’m sincerely gratitude to you, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:41, Reply)

We're the coolest people in this thread. Fact.

( Kroney, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:43, Reply)

1011101101's

( sporters I’m sincerely gratitude to you, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:43, Reply)

Ask him if he means Users rather than Customers.

( G/PP 💩💩💩💩💩&#128, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:26, Reply)

I'm going to ask him IF HE WANTS TO TAKE THIS TO THE CAR PARK

( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:50, Reply)

Is it a free one or will you both be customers there?

( sporters I’m sincerely gratitude to you, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:52, Reply)

It's all part of my 'customer journey'

( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:54, Reply)

in other news
Warp are reissuing the Dead Man's Shoes comic. I may well do a Vagabond and purchase said Graph Nov.
(dozers, do fuck off ur a nob m8, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:42, Reply)

I'm embroiled in an ongoing argument with a guy at work,
Who wants to be a ream leader, but constantly has a shitty attitude and is late. He does work hard, and is pretty good, but is so scatty and unreliable, there is no way I can leave it to him to run the pub. He seems to think the fact that he works hard and really wants it is enough. Then when I tell him I can't trust him, he turns in to a sulky teenager. He is 25.
( Windy Pig I'm naturally quite suspicious about the moon., Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:46, Reply)

lol "ream leader"

( Kroney, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:47, Reply)

fuck.

( Windy Pig I'm naturally quite suspicious about the moon., Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:50, Reply)

What sort of pub are you running, Winders?

( Kroney, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:54, Reply)

He's "scatty" and with a "shitty attitude"
Yeah, I bet he is.
( Kroney, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:58, Reply)

Still, as long as he "really wants it".
etc etc
( Kroney, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:59, Reply)

That's simply wonderful

( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:51, Reply)

wonderful Darth
( sporters I’m sincerely gratitude to you, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:51, Reply)

I believe you can get me through the niiiiiiiiiiiighhttt!

( sporters I’m sincerely gratitude to you, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:51, Reply)

What he has is 'X-Factor Syndrome' (c) me, just now
'BUT IT'S MY DREAM AND I REALLY WANT IT'
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:52, Reply)

D
( Kroney, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 12:54, Reply)

ding dong mothily on high more like

( rachelswipe with a fork, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 13:05, Reply)

Oh. You're back.

( Kroney, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 13:08, Reply)

not for long, got lunch at leon now
laters
( rachelswipe with a fork, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 13:09, Reply)

so what is the alternative to being a ream leader?
a ream recipient?
( rachelswipe with a fork, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 13:05, Reply)

Worst of all is being a 'ream peader'

( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 13:16, Reply)

I don't think I want to go to his pub

( Kroney, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 13:21, Reply)

YOU'RE ALL REALLY MEAN, I'M HAVING A BAD DAY AND YOU'RE NOT HELPING.
I just want a hug.
( Windy Pig I'm naturally quite suspicious about the moon., Wed 21 Nov 2012, 13:20, Reply)

Ask your new ream leader

( Kroney, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 13:22, Reply)

LL M
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 13:26, Reply)

Excellent

( sporters I’m sincerely gratitude to you, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 13:26, Reply)

Don't worry mate!
'Things can only get better'
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 13:35, Reply)

BrianCoxlols

( sporters I’m sincerely gratitude to you, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 13:36, Reply)

They are horrid bullies.

( Windy Pig I'm naturally quite suspicious about the moon., Wed 21 Nov 2012, 13:36, Reply)

Soz WP
Don't go all 'Two Hats' on us, I beg you.

Remember - there's no 'i' in 'ream'
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 13:38, Reply)

chortle

( sporters I’m sincerely gratitude to you, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 13:44, Reply)

this is my job:
here is a lease/right of way/option agreement/court order etc. what can you find in it to argue about to make me more money/stop someone making money out of me?

so basically every day. although most of the arguments are v clever not stupid. the last stupid argument i had.... i never really argue, tbh. if someone is a cunt i will say it, but even that's pretty rare.

cheers to mr and mrs moth.
( rachelswipe with a fork, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 13:04, Reply)

I wish them all the happiness in the future.
Interminable years of SWORN COMMITMENT, stretching out for ever into the future (or until someone turns a light on....oooh, look, a light...).......
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 13:19, Reply)

...until they both grow old and furry

( sporters I’m sincerely gratitude to you, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 13:27, Reply)

Can I just say that as a 'customer' of this thread I have found it interesting and informative, as well as jolly amusing?

( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 13:25, Reply)

No, no I can't.

( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 13:25, Reply)

In truth, yes I can.
Thanks to all esp Chompy.
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 13:28, Reply)

Not forgetting of course PD's superb marketing insight.

( Fucking hell Jeff I am not a robot, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 13:29, Reply)

Honorable mention to WP's keyboard

( The Light in Chains don't touch the Pope's boner, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 14:06, Reply)

NEW THREAD

( sporters I’m sincerely gratitude to you, Wed 21 Nov 2012, 13:45, Reply)