Much as I dislike and distrust MP's
This one news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/8045414.stm does have a point.

£92,000 to read a fucking autocue ? It's an outrage !
( Goatworrier had your mum and she was shit, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:33, archived)

I still <3 the BBC though.
I can't help it, it's hard wired into my middle class mainframe.
( TFD is sporting this season's finest necropants, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:35, archived)

Me too
it's not their fault, she could probably get £120,000 off Sky.
( Goatworrier had your mum and she was shit, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:37, archived)

Your family are in that funny fringe part of the Middle-classes that buys posh food and reads the Independant.
I suspect you consider advertising on television morally wrong.
( WormuIus, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:37, archived)

Yes
yes I do.

Also, on a point of clarification my family read the Guardian because we like Charlie Brooker swearing in the G2 and are bored of hearing about gorillas dying in the no-news Independent.

Posh food and the Guardian go together like balsamic vinegar and extra virgin olive oil.
( TFD is sporting this season's finest necropants, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:40, archived)

haha
Is this the same moral objectivity that means you think private healthcare and education is evil.
( WormuIus, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:41, archived)

Who said I believe there are any objective morals?
My family are also relativists so it works for us.

And yes, yes I do think those things you grammar schooled twat.
( TFD is sporting this season's finest necropants, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:43, archived)

haha
Try a little pragmatism in your Organic tea this evening.
( WormuIus, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:45, archived)

I never understood how you could be a walking example of consumer choice in terms of your lifestyle
choosing nicer, more expensive things over rubbish ones and paying more for them
but when the same model is applied to things like Healthcare or Education is is suddenly wrong

Are first class tickets on trains and planes also evil?
Is having a private pension rather than a state pension the poisonous work of Thatcher?
( WormuIus, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:52, archived)

EXPLAIN IT TO ME DOG GIRL

( WormuIus, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:53, archived)

First class sections on trains are evil
Normal commuters are sardined into carriages with standing room only while theres 30 or 40 seats sitting empty because no one will buy a first class ticket.

Cunts.
( Goatworrier had your mum and she was shit, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:54, archived)

So buy a first class ticket
And have 30 or 40 seats to yourself...
( Pickle Fairy is clumsily dancing away this fear, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:54, archived)

I already pay £3600 a year for a fucking unreliable sack of cunt
I'm not paying an extra grand or whatever it is for the privelege of a slightly more available seat.
( Goatworrier had your mum and she was shit, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:55, archived)

I woudl buy a first class ticket
and then wee on 39 of the seats.

But in reality I'll just drive.
( Bazongaloid, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:56, archived)

You can only drive up north
it's not feasible to drive anything other than a bus, bike, van or taxi in central London.
( Goatworrier had your mum and she was shit, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:59, archived)

I know
I live in London. I get the tube if I'm ever in the centre of town.
( Bazongaloid, Tue 12 May 2009, 14:01, archived)

Oh sorry Mr orphan child.
Is the food your mum cooks not ritzy enough for you and the massive fuck off period house you live in big enough for your small family?

I think living and learning are too essential components of humanity for the market to put a price on them.

Private schools distort the meaning of social mobility letting it rest on not how good and talented you are but on how much money your parents could afford to pay out.
( TFD is sporting this season's finest necropants, Tue 12 May 2009, 14:04, archived)

I'm very pragmatic.
I'm a pragmatic liberal socialist.

I'm also a Lib Dem.
I also crave the food hall in John Lewis on Oxford Street. (they have a special room for posh cheese!)
I also read the Guardian.
Private Eye is my bible.

I can do these things because I'm pragmatic about the fact that sometimes I'm shit at being liberal and sometimes I'm shit at being a socialist.
( TFD is sporting this season's finest necropants, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:54, archived)

I read the Daily Star & Sport back to front

( Donkey Gums @mattcomedy, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:46, archived)

Given the alternatives, that isn't hard

( Pickle Fairy is clumsily dancing away this fear, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:38, archived)

In my mind, you look like a hardboiled egg with a face drawn on it.

( WormuIus, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:39, archived)

That's nice

( Pickle Fairy is clumsily dancing away this fear, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:40, archived)

Give it a minute and he'll tug your pigtails and ping your bra strap

( Mykeyboy A massive, salty filing cabinet, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:41, archived)

But one out of its shell.
That's started to flake and crack a little bit where a child's grubby fingers have been over excitedly shelling it.
( TFD is sporting this season's finest necropants, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:41, archived)

That is outstanding.

( WormuIus, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:35, archived)

The Spam (curtain) Busters

( TFD is sporting this season's finest necropants, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:36, archived)

the great esc-rape

( WormuIus, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:38, archived)

The Dirty Dozen

( Bazongaloid, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:39, archived)

A-Cock-a-Lips Now

( TFD is sporting this season's finest necropants, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:44, archived)

The man has a point.
I'll forgive all news readers if they let me kill Natasha Kaplinsky using the mediums of rapists and ice picks.
( Captain Wow currently being a cunt in Infamous, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:36, archived)

or ice rapicks

( Edd: The Unfunny Try-Hard Edgelord, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:37, archived)

from JML.

( Captain Wow currently being a cunt in Infamous, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:37, archived)

Neither of them have points really
the NHS and prisons are not losing out becuase of MPs, but her salary is irrelevant. They both just lost their tempers.
( Bazongaloid, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:37, archived)

I don't really care, I'm just jealous of everyone earning a decent wage.

( Captain Wow currently being a cunt in Infamous, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:39, archived)

*wipes arse with a handful of £20 notes*

( Edd: The Unfunny Try-Hard Edgelord, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:41, archived)

Everyone is jealous of someone earning a decent wage
because no one really thinks they earn one.

When you earn £20k a year you're looking at people on £40k wondering why you're not earning that but when you've got £40k it doesnt seem to go anywhere and you wonder why so many people seem to earn £70k a year.

I'm sure that Newsreader sits there thinking about Anne Robinson and her £3m a year for being a ginger harridan cunt.
( Goatworrier had your mum and she was shit, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:43, archived)

£20K? I wish.
I need to leave, I earn about half as much as others do for the same job in other firms, it's just a case of having been here for 4 years and having security.
( Captain Wow currently being a cunt in Infamous, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:45, archived)

I've never met anyone who earns less than that
who has English as their first language.
( Goatworrier had your mum and she was shit, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:46, archived)

Yes you have.

( Captain Wow currently being a cunt in Infamous, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:46, archived)

Ok, sometimes
you get people born in England working in McDonalds.
( Goatworrier had your mum and she was shit, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:49, archived)

You go in McDonalds?
Ew.
( Captain Wow currently being a cunt in Infamous, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:50, archived)

Only to have a shit

( Goatworrier had your mum and she was shit, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:52, archived)

I don't believe you
you like to go and masticate reconstituted vomit with the serfs.
( Captain Wow currently being a cunt in Infamous, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:54, archived)

So what ?

( Goatworrier had your mum and she was shit, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:55, archived)

So your high horse is knee deep in the same mire as the rest of us
except me because I don't eat McDonalds.
( Captain Wow currently being a cunt in Infamous, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:58, archived)

?
What ?

So if I read lots of works of great fiction, then one day read a Nick Hornby novel because I was bored, I'd instantly become a philistine ?

Rubbish.
( Goatworrier had your mum and she was shit, Tue 12 May 2009, 14:01, archived)

It counts. That and I'm sure you're just as shit as everyone else.

( Captain Wow currently being a cunt in Infamous, Tue 12 May 2009, 14:05, archived)

I see now
how your mental powers have lead you to be earning less than 20k a year : (
( Goatworrier had your mum and she was shit, Tue 12 May 2009, 14:07, archived)

Only another 16 years to get to your level.
That's a ridiculously long amount of time, I'm sure I'll manage.
( Captain Wow currently being a cunt in Infamous, Tue 12 May 2009, 14:07, archived)

I started on 10k when I left uni,.
Two years later, I was on 11k. Before tax.
(rnuk http://flickr.com/rnuk, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:47, archived)

When was that ?
I started on £6k a year when I was 18 and that was 1988.
( Goatworrier had your mum and she was shit, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:48, archived)

My first job was 6k and then 11k in the next job (was there for 3 years when it climbed to 11.5k).

( Edd: The Unfunny Try-Hard Edgelord, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:50, archived)

Do you ask everyone how much they earn?

( Pickle Fairy is clumsily dancing away this fear, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:48, archived)

Yes
and if they dont tell me I hit them with a trout.
( Goatworrier had your mum and she was shit, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:48, archived)

Smelly

( Pickle Fairy is clumsily dancing away this fear, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:49, archived)

My receptionist job paid me about £13k pro rata (21 hours a week),
which isn't that bad for that line of work. I've just applied for a council job that pays about the same, but full time.
( Moon Girl Technologies horrendous beanbag, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:51, archived)

he's got a point about being interrupted all the time.

( Moon Girl Technologies horrendous beanbag, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:40, archived)

Yeah, I meant that.
*didn't, but would like to leap on the clever bandwagon*
( Captain Wow currently being a cunt in Infamous, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:41, archived)

I thought that was the point of interviewing MPs
Hassle them contantly. Never let them finish a point. Hopefully get them so riled up they'll say, "ALRIGHT FINE! WE STARTED THE IRAQ WAR TO STEAL THEIR FUCKING OIL! HAPPY NOW?".
( Edd: The Unfunny Try-Hard Edgelord, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:42, archived)

That's the media's point, yes.
I can see how, as a politician, it would be very annoying.
( Moon Girl Technologies horrendous beanbag, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:44, archived)

BBC link. Woo
Also, she's earning a fixed salary as set out in a contract, the fact that it's a lot of money is irrelevant, she isn't skimming money through expenses claims or avoiding paying tax on the sale of second homes.
( Bazongaloid, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:36, archived)

He's still making a valid point

MPs should stand up and ask for a decent wage for what they do and drop all the expenses bollocks. They ought to be paid about £180k a year instead of £65k plus £100k expenses
( Goatworrier had your mum and she was shit, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:40, archived)

No they shouldn't
£64,000 is a huge salary. They should have a rented place in london paid for directly, then they don't need to furnish it. They should get transport to and from their constituency paid for. But they should enter public service because they want to serve the public, not because they want the money.

He isn't making a valid point at all, her salary, a fixed amount set from the beginning, has nothing to do with dishonest expense claims.
( Bazongaloid, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:43, archived)

£64k is a huge salary ?
Maybe in Malawi, not in London.

You've got to compare it against the marketplace and you'd get more than £64k a year being an area sales manager for a Bank. Which job would you rather see attract the best candidates ?
( Goatworrier had your mum and she was shit, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:45, archived)

64k would be tops for me. I earn about 27k before tax at the moment
and I'm doing fine in London. I have money left over. But then I'm cheap and miserable and Northern. Frugal's a dirty word now, you see.
(rnuk http://flickr.com/rnuk, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:46, archived)

It's a pretty big salary by most people's standards,
but then it's a pretty important job by most people's standards as well. You can make a damn sight more than that as an accountant, if you're that way inclined.
( Moon Girl Technologies horrendous beanbag, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:48, archived)

Exactly
If you're supposed to be running the country, you ought to be paid a salary that will attract people capable of running the country.

Anyone with any brains and ambition is going to think fuck politics, no money in it unless you can get right to the top and start bending the rules and taking backhanders.
( Goatworrier had your mum and she was shit, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:50, archived)

What they need is someone with brains and no ambition.
Maybe I should go into politics.
( Moon Girl Technologies horrendous beanbag, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:52, archived)

The PM earns about £150K basic
and again, I bet you he has other sources of income. Plus when they leave office they get more money thrown at them.
( Bazongaloid, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:53, archived)

Definately
after dinner speaking, directorships etc.

If you get into the cabinet, you're laughing, but, not all of them do.

There's what 650 MP's ? So probably only 10% get to be in the cabinet and about 1% or less ever get one of the top jobs like PM or party leader. We still need those 600 odd other people to be motivated and fucking good at what they do, so they need to be well paid, it needs to be an attractive job.
( Goatworrier had your mum and she was shit, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:58, archived)

But £64K is a pretty attractive salary
the sort of people who become MPs are either self serving power mongers who think they will get the top jobs and earn all the dough, or people who genuinely want to make things better, in which case a £64K salary is pretty good, providing you can get a place in london paid for.

I'm not against having a system for allowing MPs to live near their place of work, but the house of commons has done it's best to prevent the current system being changed or scrutinised. And what is currently happening is dishonest, if not in some cases illegal.
( Bazongaloid, Tue 12 May 2009, 14:04, archived)

I wont argue that about 80% of them are dishonest and vile.
But maybe if the job was better paid it'd attract a better class of person.

or at least make it less tempting for them to be dishonest to make a bit more cash.
( Goatworrier had your mum and she was shit, Tue 12 May 2009, 14:08, archived)

I do think it's a large salary.
But expenses were introduced for exactly the reason that they hoped it would allow people to be MPs that were truly local to their constituency and genuinely interested in serving the people.

Expenses allowed poorer MPs who did not and could not afford to have 2nd homes in London to actually stand and do their jobs without what amounted to financially based discrimination.

Means test the fuckers that's what I say.
( TFD is sporting this season's finest necropants, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:50, archived)

As an MP they may earn £64K
which, regardless of what you think, is a large salary (it's more than me and my mrs earn combined and we have a very nice lifestlye living in london and could get by on less if we had to), but virtually all MPs have other sources of income too as advisors to businesses etc.

Plus there are many other perks, you aren't comparing like with like when you bring in bank sales managers.
( Bazongaloid, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:51, archived)

I bet shes got a lovely bumhole

( Mykeyboy A massive, salty filing cabinet, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:36, archived)

I hear she bleaches it
With voles tears.
( Goatworrier had your mum and she was shit, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:37, archived)

This is getting rubbish
Are we going to begrudge people luckier than us the chance to make a few quid doing a job that you perceive to be easier than yours for ever? Bitter?
(bogus official shove it up your cunt, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:37, archived)

let's face it,
there isn't a single one of us that would turn down an easy 92 grand a year. Not even me.
( Moon Girl Technologies horrendous beanbag, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:39, archived)

Exactly

(bogus official shove it up your cunt, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:40, archived)

I'm not taking a cut for anyone.

( Gooch Is neither here nor there, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:41, archived)

ha fuck yes.
he could do with brushing up on his arithmetic though, 92 isn't nearly twice 64.
( Moon Girl Technologies horrendous beanbag, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:37, archived)

She makes about £30k a year in extras
wanking off cameramen though.
( Goatworrier had your mum and she was shit, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:41, archived)

Well it's a competitive marketplace for a News outlet to get a journalist.
As for politicians, when they're in, that's it, they're in for several years.

And looking at how much some MPs are claiming for, they make well over 100k per year with the additions. I wouldn't be surprised if they claimed car allowance, too.

On top of that (ooo 'eck, I'm off), the Labour Politicians used the Royal Flight for getting home - Margaret Beckett used it to get to East Mids airport, when it's only 2 hours ish on the train.
(BombayMick Dogs are better than cats, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:40, archived)

they're only copying the civil service.

( Moon Girl Technologies horrendous beanbag, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:42, archived)

True enough.
Damn my decision to work in the private sector!
(BombayMick Dogs are better than cats, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:51, archived)

Also, you don't need any formal qualifications to become a politician...

(rnuk http://flickr.com/rnuk, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:44, archived)

My solution would be
Give them all a free flat in London and let those who have to commute more than 80 miles to Westminster claim travel and overnight expenses.

Stick them all on £100k a year, cabinet a bit more, PM probably £250k then tell them all to fuck off and get on with it.

Regardless of anything else, making them claim expenses for all sorts of shit just wastes their time.
( Goatworrier had your mum and she was shit, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:47, archived)

Good plan!
I like that idea.

In failing that, keep the current system they have now, but let it be claimed for the general public, like you and me. See how quickly they bat that one into touch :-)
(BombayMick Dogs are better than cats, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:49, archived)

He's missed the point.
People are paid to do a job. It doesn't matter how much it is. They've been dishonest with the claiming. She hasn't. He's acting like they deserve it.

I think it's the whole schemes fault not the MPs though, as I would probably put the expenses down for the copious amount of hookers I've had spank me with my leather briefcase.
( Donkey Gums @mattcomedy, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:42, archived)

True that,
thing is politicians aren't any less likely than anyone else to turn down free money if they're offered it, but for some reason we expect them to be saints.
( Moon Girl Technologies horrendous beanbag, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:46, archived)

This x3000

( TonyUNDERSCORE from the Internet, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:48, archived)

Andre3000?

( executiverocker only wears C&A, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:54, archived)

Surely it's not the MPs who claim the expenses, but the ones who authorise and clear those expenses to be paid that have to be blamed mostly.

( Edd: The Unfunny Try-Hard Edgelord, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:55, archived)

I believe
That anyone who earns more than me is a cunt
( executiverocker only wears C&A, Tue 12 May 2009, 13:46, archived)