I like to chat with Jehovah's Witnesses,
partly because they're nice people, and partly because I love demolishing dreadful reasoning, which the ones I've interacted with are really good at.
One particularly delicious example I've not had the opportunity to bring up with them is this:
A Watchtower magazine they handed to me once had an interesting article on whether or not God could see the future. In fact, they had trawled through the Bible and come up with some pretty compelling reasons (the Bible's authenticity taken as read, of course) for the decision that God could, in fact, not see the future. According to the Bible, they explained, God can't see the future. The future dances mockingly outside his grasp just like it does with all of us mortals.

The next issue I received based an entire article on God's plan and took it as read that he can see the future.

You'd think he would have seen this coming and given them a hint, but this could be one of those "mysterious ways" dealies.
(Slurpy The Frog, Sun 22 Mar 2009, 22:07, 2 replies)

God you say? I'm starting a new Elvis based religion...

Suggested prayer:

Vegas Elvis who art in Graceland
Aaron be thy middle name
the King done come
his will be done
on earth as it is in Graceland
give us each day our BK flamer
sneer us not into tee-total
and pelvis us from evil
for thine is the king creole
the jailhouse rock
and the ghetto
forever and ever

Aaron


Suggested hirearchy:

Vegas Elvis - 1st dan triple deluxe
- 2nd dan double bacon with cheese
- 3rd dan veggie special

Jailhouse Elvis - 1st dan death row
- 2nd dan lifer
- 3rd dan just visiting

Redneck Elvis - 1st dan moonshine
- 2nd dan sunshine
- 3rd dan shoeshine

Foetal Elvis - 1st dan cell division
- 2nd dan zygote
- 3rd dan nhuuhh!


States of enlightenment:

Shaking like a man on a gooby(?) tree
Ramjamfoo
Thangyooverrymudge
you'llbesolonely

Donations welcome!
(DJ_MicroClimate, Sun 22 Mar 2009, 22:01, 2 replies)

Ultimate destination
Everybody goes to heaven, It's just the bad people don't like it there
(ElGatodeBarco, Sun 22 Mar 2009, 20:13, 3 replies)

Gay Christians
What's with that?

Isn't that like being a Jewish Nazi?
( Ennui loves you, Sun 22 Mar 2009, 18:09, 3 replies)

corrupted text file
That's what the Bible is. First off, the OT is a collection of stories written down in Babylon during the Captivity. Most of the descriptions of God are wishful thinking along the lines of "our guy is a bigger motherfucker than your guy."

Then we get to the NT. Matthew and Mark were the only guys on the spot. Luke was later, a Greek doctor and scribe who wrote down a lot of stuff Paul told him, who was having a major argument with Peter over Judaic law and also the fact that Peter was just a working class peasant. John didn't write his gospel; they wanted a fourth one so they cobbled together stuff left over and thought "whose name can we put on this? I know, how about the bloke who wrote down the shroom trip".

Then we get to the scribes, who put in stuff, lost stuff, dropped gravy on the roughs and generally carried on regardless.

Then Jerome translated it into Latin. He threw out more stuff.

Then the Bible was translated into English. More than once, including one by Tolkien. Even Shakespeare had a go, leaving jokes and riddles in the Psalms. More cock ups, particularly in punctuation. There's a comma somewhere which completely changes a Gospel, depending if you're a Prod or Taig.

Which means that when a fundie comes to the door and says: "THIS IS THE WORD OF GOD", they're lying.

And how do I know all this?

Many, many priests have told me so!
(all my scars face forward possesses 2.5% of a hyperalloy combat chassis, Sun 22 Mar 2009, 17:57, 3 replies)

The other day
I was watching Life of Brian the other day with my housemate, himself not the sharpest tool in the box. Suddenly halfway through a film full of biblical references he asks me:
"Why is there so much stuff in the bible about Jesus?"
(alpha doesn't have a witty phrase to write here, Sun 22 Mar 2009, 17:41, Reply)

Get Bible, turn to page 42
Page 42 covers Genesis 37-38 in my edition ...so let's start at chapter 38 ...

1. Judah buggered off and went to live with an Adullamite bloke called Hirah...

2. Judah fancied this Canaanite girl called Shuah ... "and he took her, and went in unto her..." [from which can adduce that Shuah won't let you down, Ed]

3. She had a kid, a boy - he was called Er [as in, "Did you shag that Judah bloke and have a baby boy?" "Er..."]

4. Then Shuah had another baby, this one called Onan ...

5. And she had yet *another* sprog - when she was at Chezib incidentally - and his name was Shelah [three verses, three kids, very productive]

6. Judah sorted out a wife for his firstborn so Er married a girl called Tamar

7. Sadly, Er was a bit of a cunt so "the Lord slew him"

8. So Judah said to Onan "raise up thy seed to thy brother", or in modern English "go shag your sister-in-law, God's just topped your big brother..."

9. Onan was a bit iffy about this so didn't actually *shag* Tamar but seed-wise "spilled it on the ground"

10. And God thought, "I'm not having that" so he slew Onan as well

11. Then Judah said to Tamar, hang on til my youngest, Shelah, is grown up then he can have you - at which point things got really complicated

[12-15. Tamar went home to live with her dad; Judah's hitherto unmentioned daughter died; Judah went off to be among the sheep shearers at Timnath for comfort, taking his mate Hirah the Adullamite with him; Tamar heard that Judah had gone off for a bit, dumped the widow's threads, stuck a veil on, sat around on the road to Timnath for some reason and saw that Shelah had grown up but there was no word about marrying him, although why he was on the road to Timnath is not explained; meanwhile Judah saw this veiled woman by the side of the road and thought "harlot; because she had covered her face". He didn't know it was Tamar.

Still with me?

16. Judah said to the woman, fancy a shag? So she said, "What's in it for me?"

17. He offered her a baby goat. For a shag. Really. But she wanted some kind of pledge that he'd keep his word.

18. So he handed over his signet, his bracelets and his staff. Then they had a shag and she got pregnant.

19. She went off back to her own dad's house and put her widow's gear back on.

20. Judah lived up to his word and sent the baby goat as payment for the shag, but when his mate Hirah the Adullamite tried to deliver the wee thing, he couldn't find that harlot who was on the roadside on the way to Timnath

21. So he wandered round saying, "Where's the harlot?" but all the locals said, "What harlot? No harlots round here mate..."

22. So he went back to his pal Judah and said "No harlot!"

23. Obscure Jacobean English notwithstanding, I think Judah then said, "Oh hell, we tried."

24. Three months later Judah found out Tamar was pregnant ... "Tamar thy daughter in law hath played the harlot; and also behold she is with child by whoredom." So Judah said, "Let's burn her! Yay!"

25. So she went forth, but showed the signet, bracelets and staff to Judah...

26. And Judah said, "Oh fucksocks," admitting that she was more righteous than him and that he hadn't even given her to his son Shelah ... "and he knew her again no more..."

27. Turned out, she was going to have twins.

28. When she gave birth, the first one to look as though it was coming popped its hand out and the midwife tied some red string round the wrist so they knew which one was first...

29. ... but then the sprog pulled its hand *back in* and the other twin actually came out first and he was called Pharez ...

30. Then the one that *might* have been first, the one with the thread round the wrist, came out presently and he was called Zarah.

** *** **

Well, at least God didn't smite Onan for wanking per se ... more for not shagging his recently bereaved sister-in-law when his dad, and by extension, God, told him to. Frankly I'm with Onan on this one. Also, the Bible doesn't really explain why Er was such a cunt, why Judah didn't bother getting his lad Shelah together with Tamar, why you would call boys Shelah and Zarah anyway, there was no moral judgement about Judah rogering some alleged harlot, no comeback for the fact that Judah was a whore-fucker but Tamar was going to be burned at the stake for "whoredom", the narrative has no coherence at all really - I blame the writers - and the plot twist where the baby does and extra-vaginal hokey-cokey for just long enough for a midwife to tie some string round his wrist is hardly credible.

The Bible - a religious touchstone, a moral compass, an ethical guide and literally the word of God ... also the book that says it's okay to shag a hooker as long as you give her a baby goat ...
( writerblock ... embedding disabled by request on, Sun 22 Mar 2009, 17:15, 4 replies)

GOD
I work a 12 step program...so my god is my

Gift of Desperation.
(Oops....did I say that out loud cos I really bloody want to., Sun 22 Mar 2009, 17:09, Reply)

Many, many years ago
It was about 1972 so I would have been 9, my sister 15.

Sunday morning & the folks had gone off to church leaving me & Sis at home for reasons which escape me - normally we were dragged along too. Doorbell goes, I answer it to see to two Witnesses (I now know) standing there. They said stuff I didn't really inderstand & then showed me a copy of Watchtower they were pushing. It meant nothing to me but it did have a picture of an impy/devil-type creature being flung off a cloud by an angel. Looked really cool.
(Short fill-in: my Sis had been reading Dennis Wheatley books recently, "The Devil Rides Out", "Unholy Crusade", etc, that sort of thing, terrifically popular at the time & they all had garishly occult pictures on the covers.)

"Oh you don't want me, you should talk to Susan, she's into Black Magic" says I, as my sister appears behind me looking witch-like with long black hair & holding one of our cats she'd been brushing.
"Black Magic?" she asked enthusiastically.
"Oh no, you mustn't do that!" they said, looking very worried & swiftly walked away. They never came round again.
The whole thing went right over my head, being only 9, but when my folks returned they thought it was hilarious & my Sister still tells the story to this day.
( Dunks, Sun 22 Mar 2009, 17:06, Reply)

Jade goody
Proof that god exists.
(Freddles, Sun 22 Mar 2009, 15:48, 9 replies)

Let's work this out...
If the average person lives to the average age of 75 years and has one poo a day at the average length of eight inches per-poo, then, by time they die -with obvious variables aside- they would have laid down three and a half miles of mud biscuits!

Three and a half miles! That'll take (most) people over an hour to walk. a group lifetime effort of just twelve people could lay a faecal rope from London to Brighton. (What a day out that could become!)

The current global population of 6+billion will, going by the above calculations, create 20.7 billion miles of fudge if they were placed brown-end to end.

That's a whole load of shit.

Which is kinda my increasing attitude towards most religions. If religion ceased to exist, we could only blame ourselves for our problems.

Bill Hicks once said religion should be based on love and not fear.

I have no problem with people seeking comfort from life's hardships in religion, in fact, that's great, but religion also creates suicide bombers and puts Texans in the White House.

Ho hum.

Sorry for the long, overly simplistic read, but I'm hungover.

Ta.
( sir_spicious2000 Crap I've watched: www.filmplop.blogspot.com/, Sun 22 Mar 2009, 15:27, Reply)

When the last pope died
I won £27 in a staffroom sweepstake for making the closest guess to the hour of death.

There was one Christian girl working at the store, and for some reason she refused to speak to most of us for almost a week...
(judeski walked on water and ran through fire, Sun 22 Mar 2009, 15:05, 2 replies)

There's something absurd about family dinners. I'm pretty sure that something is my family. (a Very Typical Tale from PseudoJudaism)
My maternal grandmother and I share a strange sort of bond. Until a few years ago I just found her irritating, and while it's still annoying to be constantly offered food some humour has crept in under the door. She and my grandfather were over at our place around this time last year, and grandad insisted on having a "Pesach" "Seder" - and I use both terms loosely, even in quotation marks as they are. For one thing, the matzah on the table was completely at odds with the three loaves of bread and countless biscuits remaining in the house.

My grandad had resently had a resurgence of religious feeling, so he lit a candle in the window and was wearing a jaunty white headpiece which kept falling off. He also insisted on loudly mispronouncing some prayer or another at dinner. And then doing it again. Because he felt like it. Meanwhile my mother was desperately trying to feed my brother his (totally not kosher-le-pesach) porridge, an event which escalated into him crying and her yelling at him and trying to shove the spoon in his mouth, still to the tune of grandad's incomprehensible Hebrew, and my grandma and I just shared this Look. It went something like "you've gotta laugh or you'll cry."

Then my grandad started going on about how we were supposed to have an egg, and bitter herbs, and a shank bone, whatever that is. So I rolled my eyes, got up, pulled a raw egg, an onion and a random piece of meat (raw) out of the fridge and dumped them on the table.

"And apples! Apples and honey!"
"Grandad, that's for Rosh Ha Shana."
"Apples! Ira, pick up my hat, it's fallen down again."

My dad was fiddling with things in the kitchen (because there weren't enough stools around the tiny table and he couldn't be bothered going and fetching a big chair) and my brother had exhausted my mum's supply of persuasive techniques and was climbing on the couch. I retreated back into my corner with a jar of mulberry jam and a spoon (and some matzah, why not). Then my mum asked for the prawns, so I got up to get them, and what do I hear around the corner but a crack and the following (and do remember that all conversation is primarily in Russian):

"Whoops."
"What's the matter?"
"The egg's raw."
"I thought it was boiled?"
"...it's not."

I return to find that yes, my grandad has indeed tried to eat the egg. Which was now sitting drippily in a bowl on the table.

Naturally, we all CRACKED up laughing.
(Lieutenant Colonel Oblivious brought to you by intravenous sugar, Sun 22 Mar 2009, 14:05, 2 replies)

are father who art in heaven
please next week can we have a GOOD QOTW
(Nahla, Sun 22 Mar 2009, 12:59, 5 replies)

Fucking Pascal and his fucking gambling addiction
I cannot tell you how SMUG proponents of Pascal's Wager are when they throw it in your face. (If you've no clue what I'm talking about, look it up. go on. I'll wait.)

They're never actual Faithful types, either. They don't engage with their religion on any meaningful level, they basically just use it to score points and feel superior to atheists.

Then I point out to them that given the complete and utter absence of evidence in favour of any particular religion, if all you want is to cover your ass on the off-chance that there's an afterlife of some kind you ought to pick the friendliest religion you can find. After all, there's no greater or lesser odds for it than for the one you belong to now, is there, the one you happen to have been brought up in or that happens to be dominant in your region or social class, right?

You'd be amazed how many of them completely fail to immediately convert to unitarianism or buddhism or something.

Don't lay claim to a rationalism you don't even remotely possess, fuckers.
(Lieutenant Colonel Oblivious brought to you by intravenous sugar, Sun 22 Mar 2009, 11:30, 9 replies)

I went cycling the other week and visited a church
Once I made was sure there was nothing going on, I had a look about, run my hand around the font. There was some little books, flowers, cut for Sunday, brownish now; some brass and stuff up at the holy end and a tense, musty, unignorable silence, brewed God knows how long ago.

I had a look at the verses, and had a snigger, which echoed back at me, then left an Irish coin in the donation box (I'm a famous tightwad).

But it all made me ponder what it means? Why do I bother coming? I mean, what remains when disbelief has gone?

I wondered who will be the last to seek the church for what it was; a Xmas tourist, or an architcture fan? Or someone like me, bored and ignorant, tending to visit churches because they are suitable places to think about births, deaths and marraiges. In fact, I think churches are really serious places, where our compulsions get dressed up as destinies. Which seems like a good thing, because if you go see them you get a good reminder of all the dead that lie round.

Philip Larkin
(McChinaman banned, Sun 22 Mar 2009, 11:16, 2 replies)

I remember
that my high school R.E teacher's name was Mr. Hunt.

He used to get confused as to why we all called him Mike.
( Mellicious is made of candy, Sun 22 Mar 2009, 11:05, 2 replies)

Killing her on mothers day...
discuss
( Mr Nerdy-Speccy-FuckNuts Ouchy ouchy wa wa!, Sun 22 Mar 2009, 10:53, 11 replies)

R.E.
Children learn through education. They learn to make choices through the information fed to them in their formative years. State schools by and large don't force the R.E. down children's throats - it's the one aspect teachers can duck out of on moral grounds if they wish. Church of England Schools have a more Godly agenda. Catholic schools spend too much time on religion and not enough time on teaching.

As A Head, I believe it should be taught, but not proselytized (look it up - I had to!!) so that children have enough knowledge to make their own minds up later in life.

You can't make a decision based on ignorance, neither can it be made on fanaticism. There has to be balance.

Length? 32 years so far.
( The Lone Groover has mal des nuts., Sun 22 Mar 2009, 8:20, 7 replies)

repost
but I don't care, it's timeless.

It's extra-cute if you imagine the three wise ducks singing 'We Three Kings of Orient Are' in quacking voices.


(apeloverage committed the vile act of onanism on, Sun 22 Mar 2009, 4:33, 1 reply)

Last week
I went to a conference on Islam and Christianity. It was not a hate mongering session or a conference to ask awkward questions in the hope of making the two groups fight each other. It was actually fascinating.

It was organised by an Aussie woman who had lived in Indonesia for three years who had seen the divide between Christians and Islamic peoples and wanted to help bring them together.

Suffice it to say she's doing an excellent job - she's created this amazing organisation which travels with the intention to educate and spread tolerance.

The Christian and Islamic men and women both fit and didn't fit many of the stereotypes we see portrayed in the media. The Islamic women were dressed traditionally but were very confident and outspoken women who I quickly earned a lot of respect for in the two hours I got to listen. The Christian women were just wanting to help answer any questions we had. The men from both religions seemed both kind and devout - yet not *once* did they tell us we were soulless for having no religion. Nor did they look down on the women who were travelling alone.

It seemed to me that this group was not out to convert anybody to any particular religion but wanted to make sure everyone had all the facts right.
They also stressed the fact that the various bibles and korans have different interpretations and different people see them and place higher values on different morals.

I'm all for education of peoples on various religions - it was truly excellent. I honestly think that this group of people have a lot of potential in helping rid a lot of stereotypes that we seem to have of various religions today.
(Poppet some assembly required., Sun 22 Mar 2009, 3:51, 3 replies)

This will make sense to only a small number of people . . .
given the demographic I belong to - ie: second generation Greek, Greek Orthodox (Catholic school educated), university educated (OK, it's a medical degree so I guess that *just* scrapes in :))
GOs aren't Catholic, but once shared a common origin (I could bore everyone to tears with the Schism between the churches in Rome and Constantinople but I won't). We have similar saints, similar rituals (dunno what this Confirmation thing is though - we get baptised and that's it) and for some, a similar superiority complex.
You'll find those of my parent's generation are all religious and well-versed in the rituals - they don't question the teachings of the Church and follow most rituals without question (the importance of this will be seen later). Often, their children grow to be part of one of two camps:
1. the "fuck you" I've been forced to believe this stuff ever since I was little, I'm not bothering anymore - usually a result of parents not explaining *why* they're fasting, going to church or staying up until midnight to wait for the resurrection.
2. the "I'm just like my Mummy and Daddy" and I'm going to take my children to church every Sunday, make sure they have communion, fast and celebrate *every* religious holiday (if you'd like to know how many we have - ask Legless - lots!!!)

So where am I sitting in this spectrum? I have a number of life experiences/facets of my personality that modify how I respond to my religion.
Do I believe in God? Yes, I do - however, I don't see Him as the Earth's babysitter - if he made us intelligent beings, then he *has* to sit back and leave us to our day-to-day lives.
Do I follow everything in the Bible? No - that's impossible for anyone - and I've read a fair amount of to know that following some teachings will automatically make you reject others. Remember what I said about being intelligent? This is what riles me about fundamentalists - following the word of God literally via the Bible isn't possible - He didn't directly write it, and it's not a cookbook - it's more of a guide on how to behave - because we are intelligent enough not to need a cookbook.

As an aside - aspect of the text are instructive - very much so, especially with respect to the laws handed down in the Old Testament - dietary laws, how the tribes of Israel should dress, keep animals, etc. These were to prevent society from collapsing - much like laws today.

Where was I? Oh yes, how can I be religious GO, yet not follow everything listed as *compulsory* in my religion?
Well, let's see - a short summary of GO beliefs/rituals and how I respond to them:
1. God exists - check
2. Creation - um, nope. Scientifically impossible
3. Attendance at church on Sunday - yes, I feel the need to - NOT because I want to feel righteous sitting in the front row for 3-4 hours (yes - you read that right - our services are hours long, chanted in Biblical Greek).
4. Communion and fasting - a period of restricted dietary intake (no animal products) before receiving wine/bread - yes, and my agreement with this is thanks to my parents: if you were to prepare to meet someone important, you'd wash, dress up in clean clothes etc. Now, if you believe communion is important, then in addition you'd want to prepare your insides as well. BTW - the restriction also includes drinking and smoking; you eat modestly (no bingeing on a loaf of bread to make up for no meat).
5. Women should dress modestly for church (skirt, no sleeveless tops, no trousers, head scarf, no make up) and should not touch the icons if menstruating - no. I dress modestly because it's my habit - I'm pretty sure God doesn't care how I turn up to church, nor does He (or anyone with any sense) believe menstruation is dirty. To those that want to dress up with a scarf - more power to you - I have no desire to stand out as being ultra religious amongst the groupies who turn up every week.
6. Women stand separately to men, and cannot partake actively in the service (no girls help as altarboys (!), no women allowed in the rear section where the communion is prepared) - no. It's a pity that in 2009, we still do this. It's a ritual, not a strict teaching, and it needs to change.
7. Services in Greek - fine with me, although I acknowledge understanding what's going on can be tricky for most people of my generation; I didn't formally learn biblical Greek, however I speak modern Greek quite well and I know the English translations of the average service, so that I can follow a service quite well. My brother isn't as comfortable with following what's going on - perhaps it's time for bilingual services.
8. Divorce - not endorsed, but remarriage allowed for - fine with me; Jesus associated with the less *upright* members of society - I don't think any Church should exclude anyone who is happy to participate.
9. Abortion/contraception - frowned upon, but not to the extent of the Catholics. Left to the conscience of the individual, and most surprisingly, believed to be a private matter between you and the Big Man. My views on abortion will fill many pages . . . suffice to say, let each decide their own (without outside pressure).

Geez, I ramble on a bit don't I?
Well, almost done - I have one more issue to comment on - how I view various religions I've been in contact with. Bear in mind, some of my perspective will be coloured by the personality of the individuals I've known.

Catholicism - a traditional religion trying very hard to be *hip* - and not being very comfortable with it. Six years of Catholic teaching has left me with the impression that despite watering down things like no meat on Fridays, and Latin masses, other beliefs (abortion, divorce) smack of the same intolerance I see in more fundmentalist groups.

Jehovah's Witnesses - essentially, a group of hypocrites. Unwilling to acknowledge the contradictions in the Bible, claiming to follow it literally, and censoring the parts they don't like. Also putting lives at risk into the bargain (yes, you bastards, I mean letting people die because of refusing transfusions)

Born Again Christians - meet this lot at Uni (Monash Christian Union for anyone who knew them in the 90s). Funny lot - I agree with an earlier post of how they come across as friendly and genuine until you mention you're not about to be converted, and to leave religious conversation out of everyday talk - then - whoosh! They're gone. A little advice: practice some of that tolerance you preach.

Muslims - having had contact with both the liberal and stricter side of Islam, I must admit I quite respect the principles of what they believe. The whole culture of abuse of women, though can fuck right off (and is not universally accepted by Muslims). Having your wife covered from head to toe in a burkha while you stroll along the street in shorts . . . still makes me feel upset.

Paganism - for those who believe in reverence for our Earth - good luck to you. I spent waaaaay too much time arguing the point with "trendy pagans" (I'm sure they were Catholic school graduates) about the origins of current religions being pagan, and how we ripped off holidays and saints from them. Great, now show me what you believe, instead of bitching about how awful other religions are.

I think that's enough rambling . . . normally, I don't like religious discussions much, as they are more an argument about the logic of the rituals, *not* the beliefs. But hey, if you read this far, you either found it interesting, or you're getting your flame-thrower ready :)
( Mrs Legless . . . belongs to, well, you know . . . :), Sun 22 Mar 2009, 3:03, 8 replies)

I've been sitting here
Drinking a few cans and watching Bill Bailey. He's just reminded me of one of the best God stories I've ever heard.



Back when I was younger than I am now, I was in year 10 at upper school. I was reasonably good friends with one of the year 13 music technology students (whose name has, sadly, escaped me since then, though it may have been "Owen"). It was him that related this story to me.

It happened that Owen (for so we shall call him) had a friend who was a church organist at a small parish church. All very well and good.

Until the day referred to thereafter as "The Incident".

The local bishop had decided to visit the church. Considering that this was a tiny little church in rural Suffolk, this was quite a big deal. Owen's friend was asked to play for the service the bishop was to conduct. He agreed, but said that he would really like to play some film music. The vicar, seeing no harm in this, agreed.




Picture the scene, if you will. The local bishop walking down the nave of the church, flanked by two assistants dressed all in black and walking slightly behind him.

The organ strikes up.

What did he play?

This, of course.

Edit: The link is fully sfw, but for the full effect you should click on it with your eyes closed.




And that, my friends, is genius.
( MatJ LOOK, Sun 22 Mar 2009, 2:58, 4 replies)

I know I've posted a few negative things about religion
so now I'm going to post a positive one. It's not very funny though.

One of my best friends, a lovely lovely girl, is a devout 7th Day Adventist. I've never really understood her religion but she is one of the kindest, most open minded people I've ever met. She doesn't shove her religion down people's throats and I would say she is one of the few people I can have a serious discussion on religion with, without it coming to an argument.

One of the most important things she's taught me is that God has a different meaning to everyone, and that your view is your view and that's fine, no matter if you're athiest, agnostic, christian, muslim, jewish, sikh, or if you're deist or any other religion you could be a part of.

She helped me get through some of the toughest places I've been and she did it all without once telling me that what happened to me was part of "God's plan" for me, nor that I had been judged as deserving of it. She told me that even though shit things had happened to me it was not my fault; it was because bad people do bad things - nothing more then that.

When my grandmother died after a year of suffering, I believed her when she told me that my nan was in a better place. I still do believe that.

When her father was at the lowest point of his depression, her whole church chipped in and did everything they could to help her and her family out; making meals for them, taking the kids to school, making sure bills etc were paid on time.

So I know I'm a lot younger then most of the people here are - but the things I've seen and have received comfort from really make me think twice before calling religion stupid. I know I did so earlier - but that's a different story completely.
(Poppet some assembly required., Sun 22 Mar 2009, 2:05, 6 replies)

The Crime Fighting Saint
"So to conclude St Christopher died during the reign of the third century Roman Emperor Decius. This is my painting of St Christopher carrying the Chirst Child," a round of applause, Elizabeth Jones beams back at the class and takes her seat.

Now its my turn.

I go to the front, clutching my own painting. I hold it out in front of me. The class is waiting. My teacher, Mrs Facey, is waiting too.

"This is my painting. From this position he can kill a man in three-hundred-and-twenty different ways with his bare hands," a bit of a stir but I press on. "Look - I've drawn some blood coming out of the baddies mouth," I point this out to my classmates. "He has a jet powered car and lives in a big mansion. He saw his mummy and daddy get killed by the baddies and that's why he fights crime now he's a grown up. The biggest baddies he has to fight are the Joker and the Penguin. You can see the Joker in the background on my painting, look, over there, wearing the purple suit and he has bright green hair. He lives in a city called Gotham and-"

"Spanky!" Mrs Facey cuts me dead. She shakes her head, a strange look of pitty and puzzlement on her face. She almost whispers: "Batman isn't a saint."

This has me dumbstruck.

"Are you sure?"

Mrs Facey nods.

I stick out my chest. "Well, he should be."

And before I can continue Mrs Facey's grabbed my arm and led me back to my seat.

And my mum and Mrs Facey had another one of their 'special talks' when my mum came to pick me up from school later that day.
( SpankyHanky, Sun 22 Mar 2009, 1:16, Reply)

I don't belong to any one religion
however my sister is a catholic. She had four healthy kids, and she wasn't going to have her last one, because she was getting older and knew that risks for congenital diseases went up with age.

However my big shot bigoted catholic brother in law wouldn't let her get birth control.

Her fifth child has severe autism.

This is why I think religion is stupid sometimes.
(Poppet some assembly required., Sun 22 Mar 2009, 1:04, 6 replies)

HOW BEST TO PISS OFF A PRIEST
Sunday School, I'm about thirteen and really not enjoying it. I'm sat looking out the window at the sunshine, wishing I was out there with all the normal kids who hadn't had years of Catholic dogma fed to them like so much chopped liver.

The preist who's teaching us about some God-related twattery doesn't like me anyway. He sees I'm not paying any attention at all.

"Spanky... Spanky... SPANKY!!!" having finally caught my attention he looms over me. "That's ten Hail Mary's for gazing out the window like an idiot."

To which I reply: "I'll see your ten Hail Mary's and raise you fifteen Hail Caesars!"





...don't know why my parents insisted I went to Sunday School...

...it was like that pretty much every week...
( SpankyHanky, Sun 22 Mar 2009, 0:50, Reply)