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(, Sun 1 Apr 2001, 1:00)
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 I've been reading about this,
	I've been reading about this,www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2013/feb/03/police-spies-identities-dead-children
I can't decide if it's a big deal. What do you think?
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:12, 158 replies, latest was 13 years ago)
 I would be pretty horrified if I had a child that had died, and no one asked if they could use their identity.
	I would be pretty horrified if I had a child that had died, and no one asked if they could use their identity.(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:15, Reply)
 I'm going to say something horrible now.
	I'm going to say something horrible now.Did they have an identity if they didn't last more than a couple of days?
I'm having a bit of a crisis over all of this.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:19, Reply)
 It's a fair observation.
	It's a fair observation.I think if I'd had a kid who died and that miserable occurrence was later of use in getting some cunts arrested I think I'd be quite proud.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:21, Reply)
 Of course if it was just to nick some hunt saboteurs or whatever then I'd be rather offended.
	Of course if it was just to nick some hunt saboteurs or whatever then I'd be rather offended.(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:21, Reply)
 so,
	so, as long as you feel the work that was done in your childs name was wothy you'd be cool with that? Fair.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:24, Reply)
 Yes, I think that's my stance.
	Yes, I think that's my stance.Imagine if your child's records helped a copper bust some fucking nonce ring or something. I think I'd be pleased that some good had finally come out of something so dreadful.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:27, Reply)
 I think they mainly used the fake identities so that some undercover policemen could nob some hippy chicks.
	I think they mainly used the fake identities so that some undercover policemen could nob some hippy chicks.(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:33, Reply)
 what if they used both your child's name and corpse to bust open a necro-nonce ring?
	what if they used both your child's name and corpse to bust open a necro-nonce ring?(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:35, Reply)
 it seems rather lacking in imagination
	it seems rather lacking in imaginationi mean, anyone can make up a name.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:16, Reply)
 but you need it to be pretty tight if someone starts earching around about,
	but you need it to be pretty tight if someone starts earching around about, so you need a real birth record. I can't see why the police couldn't just put a fake one in?
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:18, Reply)
 well quite
	well quitegiven the choice between taking people's records without the consent of their bereaved parents, and passing a law allowing a government department to issue fake records for this one tightly controlled purpose, i think the latter is more palatable, actually.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:22, Reply)
 i imagine it would be abused though.
	i imagine it would be abused though. but then, everything is really.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:25, Reply)
 exactly
	exactlywhat they should do is put you and me in charge. we are incorruptible. and we would in no way give all the police offers names like pat mcgroin and wayne kerr.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:25, Reply)
 normally their rank is something like sergeant
	normally their rank is something like sergeant I don't think they'd believe bacon is a real rank.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:40, Reply)
 Wasn't it so that there'd be birth records if someone was being checked up on?
	Wasn't it so that there'd be birth records if someone was being checked up on?I assumed this was why, rather than just for lolz. I have to say I didn't read the article.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:18, Reply)
 I'd think the accompanying death certificate would be a bit of a giveaway.
	I'd think the accompanying death certificate would be a bit of a giveaway.(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:21, Reply)
 our computers are borked for the second time in a week
	our computers are borked for the second time in a weekit is so so so irritating. you should come and fix them.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:22, Reply)
 I know a lawyer, who's a bit of a dog. She's got the same first name as the mutt my grandmother had when I was a kid.
	I know a lawyer, who's a bit of a dog. She's got the same first name as the mutt my grandmother had when I was a kid.Funnily enough, the dog was overweight too...
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:18, Reply)
 i have many more peaches on my phone........
	i have many more peaches on my phone........anyone want to see a picture of battered giving lighty a reacharound?
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:21, Reply)
 if there were a speech bubble coming out of lighty's mouth
	if there were a speech bubble coming out of lighty's mouththat is exactly what it would be saying. poor molested lighty.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:25, Reply)
 :(
	:(I've been nothing but nice, and I'm going to be collateral damage!
Paste Monty's head on instead.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:31, Reply)
 Not really.
	Not really.Were any of those names particularly exclusive? I doubt it.
The sad thing about dead babies is that they died.
It was probably pointless to use the names of dead babies, but I think it was also pointless releasing this information now.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:18, Reply)
 It's a method of creating an identity that has been used for a long time
	It's a method of creating an identity that has been used for a long timeIIRC it was detailed in 'Day of the Jackal'.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:18, Reply)
 It was
	It wasAlso gets frequently used for fraud, in benefits, fake ID's and so on
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:20, Reply)
 That was my thought
	That was my thought it's a bit "well, duh, that's how it's done".
See also "Highlander", although for different reasons.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:20, Reply)
 What's really good is when a girl is raped and dies in detention, because then you can use their ID for spying and lulz.
	 What's really good is when a girl is raped and dies in detention, because then you can use their ID for spying and lulz.(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:20, Reply)
 It doesn't strike me as a huge deal
	It doesn't strike me as a huge deal,it's hardly Alder Hay disposing of parts of their body without telling anyone. Then again I am not the parent of a child either dead or living. I guess I may feel differently if I was. Although as long as I didn't bump into my long dead "son" when he was undercover at some hippy fest shagging his suspects, i'm not sure I'd care. Also I'm not sure why I'd bump into him while he was shagging his suspects.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:18, Reply)
 They have to comb archives of dead children to come up with the name "John Barker"?
	They have to comb archives of dead children to come up with the name "John Barker"?Fucking hell. That's pitiful.
Gary Roedean.
Jonathon Pace
Ibrahim Ali.
Those are three just off the top of my head. All better names than John fucking Barker. There you go, Met, you can have those for free. I am available to make names up for you professionally if you want, you pitiful, stupid, unimaginative cunts.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:20, Reply)
 Good one Kroney.
	Good one Kroney.I'll just check the birth records for those people and there will be legitimate records won't there?
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:22, Reply)
 Good one, Monty, check the records and you'll find their death certificates, too.
	Good one, Monty, check the records and you'll find their death certificates, too.(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:23, Reply)
 You will on the real people.
	You will on the real people.Unless it's not ok for the Police to make up birth certificates for pretend people, but it *is* ok for them to hide the death certificates of real people.
The latter is certainly more disturbing than the former.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:28, Reply)
 You need a birth certificate to get other government documents issued
	You need a birth certificate to get other government documents issuedThey point is they don't by default check for a death certificate, and they're harder to check anyway as they're considered medical records.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:34, Reply)
 It's fine Lighty, Kroney's embarrassed enough about his spasticated post as it is.
	It's fine Lighty, Kroney's embarrassed enough about his spasticated post as it is.No need to rub it in.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:42, Reply)
 Wasn't Ibrahim Ali in the ill-fated, post John Squire, Stone Roses?
	Wasn't Ibrahim Ali in the ill-fated, post John Squire, Stone Roses?(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:23, Reply)
 I was feeling profoundly meh about the whole thing
	I was feeling profoundly meh about the whole thingthen I saw Keith Vaz was against it, so I now think all police officers should be given the identities of dead babies and then go to life with the bereaved parents.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:22, Reply)
 this was basically my point
	this was basically my pointI cannot remember exactly why, but I know he's a colossal cunt.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:25, Reply)
 It's not very nice, but then the parents were never going to find out until the papers reported it.
	It's not very nice, but then the parents were never going to find out until the papers reported it.(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:24, Reply)
 I blame the Telegraph.
	I blame the Telegraph.or the stupid police man who didn't keep his fucking mouth shut.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:27, Reply)
 In my opinion, the fact that it was going on without parents knowing makes it worse, not better.
	In my opinion, the fact that it was going on without parents knowing makes it worse, not better.I'm pretty sure that, if contacted, a lot of people would be fine with the Police using their child's details in the pursuit of criminals. A lot wouldn't, but they should have the choice on how their child's name is used.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:30, Reply)
 That's also a fair enough view.
	That's also a fair enough view. The main thing I have a problem with in this whole story is that using dead childrens birth certificates was like option one.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:32, Reply)
 well, then we should go the way that organ donering ought to be, and make it an opt out thing
	well, then we should go the way that organ donering ought to be, and make it an opt out thingIf you give enough of a shit, you can make the effort to opt out, otherwise, we will assume you're cool to have your dead kids name used, and we can have your kidneys.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:34, Reply)
 They should just take peoples' organs secretly, too.
	They should just take peoples' organs secretly, too.Oh wait, that totally happened.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:37, Reply)
 do you have a problem with someone taking your organs when you're dead?
	do you have a problem with someone taking your organs when you're dead?(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:39, Reply)
 I have both of these songs on the same playlist.
	I have both of these songs on the same playlist.How wacky is that???
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:51, Reply)
 I'm not an organ donor
	I'm not an organ donorIf I'm not an organ donor, then assuming I'd have a problem with it should be the default position.
I'm not saying I do have a problem with it, but giving you my preference wouldn't answer the question you should have asked in response to the point I was making.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:45, Reply)
 Fair enough,
	Fair enough, I'm just in the "well, a dead kid doesn't really need those organs, and they might do some real good, so go for it"
Admittedly, doing it in secret seems a bit daft, as I'm sure a lot of people would be cool with their kid saving another kids life, unless they are some sort of selfish religious bollock head.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:50, Reply)
 There's nothing wrong with that opinion, don't get me wrong.
	There's nothing wrong with that opinion, don't get me wrong.But the parents have the rights to choose what's done with their dead kids. I think that applies to their names as well as their bodies. I'm yet to see a convincing argument otherwise that isn't "I don't really have a problem with it", which isn't any sort of argument at all.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:54, Reply)
 Yeah, but it would ruin the whole point if it was made public knowledge.
	Yeah, but it would ruin the whole point if it was made public knowledge. (, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 11:04, Reply)
 Perhaps we should ask why this has come to light now?
	Perhaps we should ask why this has come to light now? Perhaps it's part of the gradual drip of attacks on the police to get them ready to be privatised.
See here for more examples, particularly the John Humphries one.
inspectorgadget.wordpress.com/
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:27, Reply)
 No, I just find it interesting.
	No, I just find it interesting.at least it makes no secret of being biased.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:34, Reply)
 Not bad at all
	Not bad at all10:30 and it's already been a long week. Such is life.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:34, Reply)
 Morning.
	Morning.I overheard a conversation in the pub yesterday, and this girl was telling her mate that she has a third kidney. Do you reckon that counts as a super power?
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:35, Reply)
 Just in case she gets a flat
	Just in case she gets a flatI swapped mine over for winter kidneys in Novermber
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:38, Reply)
 This was part of the plot of The Day of the Jackal.
	This was part of the plot of The Day of the Jackal.It seems sensible to me. The alternative is to have fake birth recoreds created, which could be found to be false by a determined counter intelegence agent.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:30, Reply)
 I liked Day of the Jackel
	I liked Day of the Jackelit was way better than the piece of shit remake with Richard Gere where they try and make out that the IRA are freedom fighters.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:48, Reply)
 I really don't think it's appropriate for you to post in a thread about children. Particularly dead ones.
	I really don't think it's appropriate for you to post in a thread about children. Particularly dead ones.(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:35, Reply)
 Because he has admitted to being sexually attracted to underage girls.
	Because he has admitted to being sexually attracted to underage girls.(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:38, Reply)
 I wonder how many of these same identities have been used for criminal purposes?
	I wonder how many of these same identities have been used for criminal purposes?Seems a bit more logical to be upset by that, if you ask me.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:41, Reply)
 It's pretty logical to be upset
	It's pretty logical to be upsetby people using the details of your loved ones without bothering to tell you, as though your feelings weren't important.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:49, Reply)
 Perhaps I'm completely heartless
	Perhaps I'm completely heartlessbut I really can't see what there is to be upset about. Then again, as Scarpe said earlier, I'm not a parent.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:57, Reply)
 Neither am I, but I can see how people would be upset by it.
	Neither am I, but I can see how people would be upset by it.Personally, I might not be. That doesn't stop me from seeing the issue.
So yeah. Heartless. Soz.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 11:00, Reply)
 Cool.
	Cool.What if they made up random names and birthdates, and just happened to land on ones that matched dead babies? I mean, if it really was done randomly, would they still be at fault?
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 11:03, Reply)
 If my kid died
	If my kid diedI'd have better things to worry about than whether or not some copper is out there using the name Battlecat Tatooine.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:42, Reply)
 The ones of PJ and his kids playing their 'special Star Wars roleplay'?
	The ones of PJ and his kids playing their 'special Star Wars roleplay'?You disgust me.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:45, Reply)
 Yup, those ones.
	Yup, those ones.He promised I could have them once Bartleby had finished with them.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:48, Reply)
 so....... much...... punctuation............................................................
	so....... much...... punctuation............................................................(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 11:00, Reply)
 ROFLCOPTERS
	ROFLCOPTERSOffice discussion just now, talking about birds (feathered variety)
Chris: "Theres a question. Do birds have cocks?"
TC: "In Thailand, yes"
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:44, Reply)
 you have now put the top cat tune in my head
	you have now put the top cat tune in my headi hope you get a boil right over your japs eye.
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:48, Reply)
 oooooof
	oooooofif his belt weren't already so low, you'd have been below it
(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:58, Reply)
 This is my favourite reply of the day just because of it's brutal simplicity.
	This is my favourite reply of the day just because of it's brutal simplicity.(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:54, Reply)
 Who ever clicked that 'raped and dies' post, thanks.  It looks *great* on the popular page like that...
	Who ever clicked that 'raped and dies' post, thanks.  It looks *great* on the popular page like that...(, Mon 4 Feb 2013, 10:58, Reply)
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