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Cigarettes to be sold from under the counter

blog and archive

(

beaubodor blogless, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 11:55, archived)

another god awful waste of time and money

Thanks Government!
Way to put newsagents out of business

(

Joe Scaramanga with a G-double-O-D vibration, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 11:55, archived)

I am not sure it will put newsagents out of business.

There is fuck all profit on snout at any rate.

(

LordManley twitter.com/LordManley, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 11:57, archived)

But its the other stuff

you go in for fags and buy a paper, magazine, drink etc

(

Joe Scaramanga with a G-double-O-D vibration, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:01, archived)

But you still will,

it'll just not be on the wall?

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LordManley twitter.com/LordManley, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:03, archived)

Depending on the magazine you may buy some tissues as well:p

'ningles all.

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riverghost servicing your mum since, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:23, archived)

Caravan Monthly

*fwaps*

ningles ghosty!

(

Joe Scaramanga with a G-double-O-D vibration, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:26, archived)

Phoar!

or The Wippet Digest!

(

riverghost servicing your mum since, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:28, archived)

Well, they have let the Supermarkets kill / squeeze out

the pubs, and highstreet butcher baker hardware shop, I see it as the next logical step, I mean why would I want a shop on my high street?

Arrrrggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

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The magic of chutney Shakes it like an Instagram filter!, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 11:59, archived)

Smokers:

Scum. Subhuman scum.

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Je suis un vagabond is an unfunny, up your own arse middle class knob, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:02, archived)

i respectfully disagroove

(Fuckpig "That's not even a pound a midget.", Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:09, archived)

*lights up*

*blows smoke in your face*
*laughs*

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Jenk Neptune is a pedant and now I can't fit my sig in, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:12, archived)

Watch your Alan Partridge video.

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Je suis un vagabond is an unfunny, up your own arse middle class knob, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:22, archived)

Nice.

I actually approve - the massive cartons serve as excellent advertising and this makes the law fair and sensible.

Of course, that said, I want a world where they don't vilify smoking in the first place and having a fag is not evil, just fun.

Why am I living in the future already? no drinking on the tube, no cigarettes, what the fuck was the point in all the years of fighting oppressive regimes if we just have one from here and take over?

(

LordManley twitter.com/LordManley, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 11:57, archived)

Hmmm...

I think your definition of "opressive" might be a bit wide...

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Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:02, archived)

I can see no excuse for banning personal behaviour which does not affect others.

Unruly behaviour by drunk people should not reflect upon all people who drink, any more than a Chinaman robbing the Post Office means all Chinamen should be arrested.

Preventing individuals from doing things which do not have a negative affect on others is oppression.

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LordManley twitter.com/LordManley, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:05, archived)

john stuart mill

(Fuckpig "That's not even a pound a midget.", Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:10, archived)

Of his own free will?

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LordManley twitter.com/LordManley, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:10, archived)

Drank half a pint of shandy as was particularly ill?

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The Great Architect is still waiting for his account to be deleted on, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:11, archived)

Plato, they say

could stick it away.

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LordManley twitter.com/LordManley, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:13, archived)

Half a crate of Whiskey every day...

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The Great Architect is still waiting for his account to be deleted on, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:14, archived)

aristotle aristotle

was a bugger for the bottle

(Fuckpig "That's not even a pound a midget.", Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:15, archived)

and Hobbes was fond of a dram

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The Great Architect is still waiting for his account to be deleted on, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:16, archived)

and renee descartes was a drunken fart!

'I drink therefore I am!'
OI!

(Fuckpig "That's not even a pound a midget.", Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:17, archived)

Socrates himself is particularly missed...

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The Great Architect is still waiting for his account to be deleted on, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:18, archived)

...on account of being continually pissed

/set em up knock em down

(theswollenbeef where there's a will there's a wank, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:31, archived)

Well, partly.

But you're assuming that Mill is correct.

And, at least here, I don't think he is.

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Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:11, archived)

i'm of the liberal school

i think that the oppression of viewpoints,actions and ideals is always negative,as it robs the future of serious debate and impinges on the rights of the individual.
i see the freedom of the individual and responsibility going hand-in-hand,so that the individual can choose what he does rather than be todl what he can and cannot do.

(Fuckpig "That's not even a pound a midget.", Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:14, archived)

Ah-ha

I'm more of an anti-liberal.

You're right to say that opression is wrong - but that's trivial, because the important question has to do with deciding what is oppressive to begin with.

You're also assuming that there's such a thing as a right - something that Mill never claims, incidentally. I'm suspicious of the notion of rights, for metaphysical, epistemological and historical reasons. I can make much more sense of the notion of duties or responsibilities - but, even then, it's wholly formal, and we'd still need to know what they are.

But then again, I'm an irremediable Kant.

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Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:20, archived)

you're correct,a 'right' has no real existence.it is conceptual.

we do have a duty to our state (if you advocate paternalism)
but i believe the individual should act as he likes as long as he DOES NO ACTIVE HARM to another.all actions have consequences,and i feel smokers should take pains to only fuck themselves up,not anyone else (like kids).
but I ABSOLUTELY ADVOCATE THE RIGHT TO CHOOSE

(Fuckpig "That's not even a pound a midget.", Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:25, archived)

Nope.

Paternalism does not mean that we have duties to anyone.

Your claim about liberty has a problem of normativity, though. For example, I used to climb the fireguard as a child. This was what I wanted to do, and I was harming noone else. Nor would I have harmed anyone by continuing to do so. However, I don't think my parents wronged me by removing me therefrom.

So it would appear that some violations of strict liberty might not be problematic. The problem you then have is one of determining where the line is to be drawn between the problematic and the non-problematic. I'm not sure that it can be done.

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Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:30, archived)

mill thought of this

he stated that the harm principal did not apply to children and people of less-developed nations.his phraseology,not mine.
and,as i said,i advocate choice,intelligent choice as the only way forward.the individual must take responsibility for his own actions.it is deferred responsibility that is ruining the western world.

(Fuckpig "That's not even a pound a midget.", Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:34, archived)

I know Mill thought of this

But he doesn't provide a satisfactory answer that I can see. And he didn't talk about less-developed nations. He talked about barbarians and nations in their "nonage" (On Liberty, ch. 1).

I don't understand the leap you've made to the Spenglerian point about the decline of the west. It seems to have nothing to do with anything that anyone's said here hitherto.

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Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:42, archived)

Not necessarily.

You need some account of their entitlement to do that action as well, and of the intention of the person putting the difficulties in place. If there's no right to smoke, then it being more difficult to do so, or to sell cigarettes, is not really oppressive. And there is no such right.

Moreover, the intention behind a lot of the hurdles to smoking is beneficence-based. That, too, undermines claims to oppression, doesn't it?

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Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:11, archived)

Wha? Everything we could do has to be laid out in law somewhere before it becomes wrong to interfere with it?

Positive rights suck ass.

(_Felix 's school of dance and occult sciences, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:14, archived)

That's not what I said.

Read the shapes I made with my keyboard and words.

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Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:16, archived)

I bet it is what you said anyway

but I'll give it a go.
Edit: since you say below you don't like the concept of a right, perhaps what you're saying here is that there are no rights to anything, and therefore there is never any oppression. This leaves me in the dark about what you think there is.

(_Felix 's school of dance and occult sciences, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:21, archived)

I'm much happier with talk of responsibilities

... or of actions, laws, restrictions and so on that are kata ton orthon logon: in accordance with reason.

There's more to moral debate than appeals to rights. I don't think that such appeals to rights help; I suspect they get in the way of clarity.

The absence of rights doesn't mean that liberty is meaningless; nor does it mean that there's no such thing as oppression. Why should it?

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Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:54, archived)

So why is a law that interferes with smoking not oppressive?

You mentioned the intent (it's for the smokers' own good), but is it at least unfair? Do you have no principle against coercing people for their own good? How would fines for hang-gliding shape up? Very bad for you, hang-gliding, lots of broken limbs, no merit other than enjoyment.

(_Felix 's school of dance and occult sciences, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 13:02, archived)

No.

I think that there is a right to behave in accordance to personal wishes where that does not negatively impact others.

Tobacco is a readily available plant - if an individual wishes to burn it and inhale it I can imagine no possible defence for preventing this.

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LordManley twitter.com/LordManley, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:15, archived)

I think it does negatively impact on others.

If someone lights up in front of me when i'm walking down the road I have to make sure i'm not down wind as i think cigarette smoke stinks like fuck. When spending evenings in pubs/gig venues/peoples houses where there are smokers I invariably end up leaving with a sore throat and smelling like an ashtray.

You would complain if I farted in your face so I respectfully ask you to keep your noxious fumes out of mine.

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Cliff Apparently enjoys fishing for leopards on weekends, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:26, archived)

No, I would not complain if you farted.

This is because I understand that everyone is different and that other enjoy things which I do not.

I do not smoke, but I resent the fact that being a minority makes it a target.

A slight odour does not count as significant discomfort for others.

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LordManley twitter.com/LordManley, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:30, archived)

The significance of the discomfort

need not be a consideration.

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Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:36, archived)

Well, to go back to JSM, if I may

offense is not harm

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LordManley twitter.com/LordManley, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:42, archived)

Well, that's not clear.

Mill thinks that it isn't. I'm not so sure - and by this I do mean that I don't know. I've been toying with the idea of writing something on offensiveness for a while now.

Whether or not it is, though, you're presupposing that it's the outcome of an action that makes the difference. It might be that you can be wronged without being harmed at all, or that any harm is wrong to the same extent, and that the degree thereof is a mere detail.

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Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:47, archived)

Indeed, I agree with the theory

but I have personally addressed the questions and believe that the level of offence and harm IS important.

Aside from this, I believe that intent, rather than effect, is the governing factor in behaviour, but that does not apply to this argument.

Lunch, however, does.

Cheerio!

(

LordManley twitter.com/LordManley, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:51, archived)

Christ!

Lunchtime already!

T'ra!

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Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:55, archived)

I am happy for people to enjoy smoking

but being in a smoky environment does diminish my enjoyment of an evening.

It's not targeted because it's a minority, jugglers are a minority but they're not targeted. It's targeted because it's not good for you or the people around you. Or do you doubt that second hand smoke is dangerous?

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Cliff Apparently enjoys fishing for leopards on weekends, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:40, archived)

I doubt that second hand smoke in a unenclosed environment

is measurably detrimental to your health.

Yes.

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LordManley twitter.com/LordManley, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:43, archived)

That was a wonderful answer to a question I didn't ask.

A fine politician you'll make.

I agree mind you on the point that it isn't harmful in open air. Yet to your original point I still feel a negative impact is still there.

You've gone from negative impact to significant discomfort to harm. These are not synonyms. Smoking in the open air indeed may not harm me but I do say it has a negative impact. Smoking inside does harm and cause significant discomfort. Which effect would you like to argue?

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Cliff Apparently enjoys fishing for leopards on weekends, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 13:03, archived)

Racists are negatively impacted by blacks.

I am talking about smoking in unconfined spaces or alone. I am talking about harm.

My answer perfectly matches the question you asked in the context of the thread. It may not have matched the question which you intended to ask, but I cannot reasonably be expected to make inferences based upon oblique implications.

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LordManley twitter.com/LordManley, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 13:33, archived)

Walking around is dangerous, you might barge into somebody.

(_Felix 's school of dance and occult sciences, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:44, archived)

So in summary, let's ban farting.

Everybody must wear some kind of gas-filtering nappy, by law. The police will perform routine checks to make sure we are wearing our nappies. Cans of beans, which must by law be unattractive, will carry large labels stating "this food WILL cause flatulence", and somewhere underneath, in smaller print, "baked beans". They will be heavily taxed. This will make the world a better place.

(_Felix 's school of dance and occult sciences, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:36, archived)

This would be good for some people I know.

but i think we're safe just sticking to the generally accepted social convention that it's not polite to fart in someone's face.

That's all that I would ask of smokers, a little consideration for those non-smokers around you.

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Cliff Apparently enjoys fishing for leopards on weekends, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:47, archived)

Aha!

Now, consideration is an issue here, not smoking.

There are twats out there - they need to be stopped, but lumping all smokers in with the arseholes is not reasonable at all.

'Some smokers are idiots. Ban smoking!'

'Someone used paint to write on a wall. Ban all paint!'

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LordManley twitter.com/LordManley, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:53, archived)

I would still rather see smoking disappear entirely.

but one has both ideals to reach for and realistic goals.

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Cliff Apparently enjoys fishing for leopards on weekends, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 13:09, archived)

I'd like to see golf disappear entirely.

Our opinions on other people's hobbies are worthless. Except of course that smokers tend to be irrational, perhaps more so than golfers. This much I can say with confidence is a bad thing. Whether rational smoking is good or bad ... well, I've never found cigarettes appealing. I've also never found avocados appealing. I'm not confident in my ability to say whether these things are good or bad for other people, I suspect the issues may be too complex.

(_Felix 's school of dance and occult sciences, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 13:26, archived)

Expecting consideration is perfectly reasonable

(Being perfectly reasonable is considerate. Blargh, tautologies.)

(_Felix 's school of dance and occult sciences, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:54, archived)

Hmmm...

I just have no time for the concept of a right.

Actually, there's more than that. I simply can't make sense of it. I'll happily embrace a lot of what's defended by an appeal to rights as a good thing - but that doesn't make the defence any more reliable, and there're better ways to skin those particular cats.

(

Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:33, archived)

I like this post

for it is informative and thought-provoking without being condescending

I will vote for it in the forthcoming election

(

Mighty Nibus who dares gins | @nibus, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:19, archived)

*takes bow*

(

Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:21, archived)

Or it's "intervention".

People apparently want the government to turn their friends and neighbours into better behaved, more sensible people, and that's why we have all this crap. Because the attitude that it's alright for everyone to apply mild coercion to everyone else is widespread. Policies are to some extent the fault of the public, since the government studies our opinions to see what we'll swallow.

(_Felix 's school of dance and occult sciences, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:20, archived)

I've got my CCTV set up

so I can spy on the neighbours to see if they're watching TV ads for alcohol

while I have a wank

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Mighty Nibus who dares gins | @nibus, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:21, archived)

Every one must comply?

It worries me that anyone would think that was a good thing.

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LordManley twitter.com/LordManley, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:25, archived)

I dunno...

there must be some attraction to it. Dictators keep popping up.

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Cliff Apparently enjoys fishing for leopards on weekends, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:31, archived)

People do definitely buy them on a whim, though, so I can see how keeping them out of sight would work.

(

An Eagle in Your Mind, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 11:57, archived)

That nicotine's certainly a bit moreish...

(

IHaveABadFeelingAboutThis most likely working from home on, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 11:59, archived)

"Kick that nicotine whim!"

with Whimorette!

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beaubodor blogless, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:00, archived)

Pffft

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IHaveABadFeelingAboutThis most likely working from home on, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:02, archived)

It's a lot like that nice heroin you get these days

I find one is never enough....

(

The magic of chutney Shakes it like an Instagram filter!, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:01, archived)

If I've not had my morning cup I'm just not right...!

~~cup~~ armful

(

IHaveABadFeelingAboutThis most likely working from home on, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:03, archived)

(

An Eagle in Your Mind, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:02, archived)

*tries crack*

*sues*

(

Je suis un vagabond is an unfunny, up your own arse middle class knob, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:03, archived)

*tries Sue's crack*

(

IHaveABadFeelingAboutThis most likely working from home on, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:04, archived)

and for the politically minded - one on Boris Johnson's most recent troubles

"Boris, How do you want your eggs, fried or boiled?..
or on your face as usual."

blog and archive

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beaubodor blogless, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 11:57, archived)

Brilliant!

(

J Peasemould Gruntfuttock Alpha Mike Foxtrot, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:00, archived)

nicely squire

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god save the queen making another unremarkable comeback, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:03, archived)

Oh that's SMASHING!

Woo!

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Sir Aunty Grampa Dave the Hat - enjoying a post-meridian muncheon - Ta! Cannaoogim!?, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:04, archived)

Ahhh hahahaha

(asciifaceofbob bob bob bob bob bob bob bob, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:06, archived)

I don't smoke but I find this annoying

afterall the whole point of putting cigs on display is that you can see the price!

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maiden is filmed before a live studio audience, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 11:58, archived)

I do not smoke cigarettes, but it is shit.

What is the score with not being able to smoke in open spaces, such as open rail platforms, parks, hospital grounds and so on?

Why the fuck gives anyone the right to dictate what others do to themselves?

(

LordManley twitter.com/LordManley, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:00, archived)

You have not come to terms with the fact that

democracy and freedom is a facade and in actual fact we are property of the state!

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maiden is filmed before a live studio audience, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:03, archived)

is it that strict over there?

here smoking in public is within open spaces and im fine with it.

though idon't want to be in a lift with someone smoking

(k3b/-\b Peace man., Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:04, archived)

aside from anything else, smoking in open spaces such as you describe,

leads to extra cleaning, as very often bins are not provided, and even if they are, there's still
a high amount of smokers who drop and stomp their butts anywhere they like.
Irrespective of anything else, at least it helps reduce part of the litter problem they cause.
Mind you, this is a minor point in the grand scheme of things

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The Great Architect is still waiting for his account to be deleted on, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:04, archived)

Last time I went to the station I saw a little boy vomit on the stairs.

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Captain Wow currently being a cunt in Infamous, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:05, archived)

Drunk again - the youth of today!

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maiden is filmed before a live studio audience, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:06, archived)

Ban this sick filth.

(

An Eagle in Your Mind, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:06, archived)

~~filth~~

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Sir Aunty Grampa Dave the Hat - enjoying a post-meridian muncheon - Ta! Cannaoogim!?, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:07, archived)

Was he fined?

Was he made to pick it up?
Was he abused by passers by?

(

Joe Scaramanga with a G-double-O-D vibration, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:07, archived)

Scampered off onto the train.

Git.

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Captain Wow currently being a cunt in Infamous, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:09, archived)

BAN THOSE CHILDREN!!

put them under the counter

(

harribobs invented christmas on, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:08, archived)

Littering is the problem there,

not smoking.

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LordManley twitter.com/LordManley, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:06, archived)

Fair point...

But when, in the absence of a bin withing a couple of metres, did you last see a smoker stub out his cigarette and take the butt away for disposal later?

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Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:08, archived)

no, smoking is fine, but the butts often cause the litter

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The Great Architect is still waiting for his account to be deleted on, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:09, archived)

Indeed.

I have no problem with punishing littering, but find the idea that banning smoking is the way to stop fag buts, rather than enforcing the ban on dropping them.

Let's ban all streets - that'll stop street crime.

(

LordManley twitter.com/LordManley, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:12, archived)

Start with Street in Somerset.

Clark's Village for the ultimate, cacophonous loss.

^{/West Country obscurity}

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An Eagle in Your Mind, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:20, archived)

I went to school in Street

/Millfield boy

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LordManley twitter.com/LordManley, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:24, archived)

I thought Clark's Village was hell on earth

but then I went to the new Westfield last week and found the hidden layer of hell

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Joe Scaramanga with a G-double-O-D vibration, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:25, archived)

I am full to the brim with excuses not to go there.

I only have to use them a couple of times a year, but it was a decent investment nevertheless.

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Kallus speaks for the Spores, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 13:47, archived)

Well -

I've not heard of it being banned in parks or open rail platforms. Any links?

Hospital grounds banning smoking, though, seems to me not to be unreasonable, what with hospitals being about health, an' all...

(

Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:04, archived)

Railway platforms count as enclosed spaces.

There's certainly signs up.

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IHaveABadFeelingAboutThis most likely working from home on, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:06, archived)

If a relative of mine dies in hospital and someone tries to stop me having a ciggie outside the hospital

it'll be bloody dangerous for their health.

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Captain Wow currently being a cunt in Infamous, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:06, archived)

This.

Find me some documentation on the health affects of smoking.

I think that statistically smoking over 20 a day reduces the life span by 2 years?

Compare this to car related issues - why do we allow ambulances to drive on hospital grounds? We should ban CDs TODAY - they are made with plastics.

(

LordManley twitter.com/LordManley, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:10, archived)

I'm currently watching my dad go through a rather awful bout of treatment for Hepatitis C

(he may have got this due to blood transfusions/shots in the Army, so another aside to this comment is to ask you if you've been tested for it).

He drank for years and years, which didn't help it, and really fucked things up for a long time. Cirrohsis, for one.

Are they going to demonise alcohol? Are they bollocks.

(

Captain Wow currently being a cunt in Infamous, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:13, archived)

Its alraedy started

but on a much smaller scale

I reckon we will see tv ads for alcohol banned in our lifetime

(

Joe Scaramanga with a G-double-O-D vibration, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:16, archived)

I want to see ads for TVs banned in alcohol

(

Mighty Nibus who dares gins | @nibus, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:20, archived)

20 minutes on the tube

is equivelent of smoking two fags in terms of the carconegins you inhale

(

Joe Scaramanga with a G-double-O-D vibration, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:14, archived)

Probably more like 19 for me.

Why is it I'm always stood/sitting next to The Man With All The Aftershave In The World On?

(

Captain Wow currently being a cunt in Infamous, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:15, archived)

That's a specious comparison, and you know it.

But let's take it at face value. Maybe some lives would not be ended by ambulances if there were none. But a lot of people would be made worse off directly.

Now perform the same thought-experiment with cigarettes. Not quite the same result.

Look: of course there's a trade-off to be made. But noone'd deny that. And since smoking does nothing at all to promote health, and ambulances do quite a bit, it's clear which way the trade should go on that one.

The actual measure of the harm of smoking isn't all that important here, I don't think. It's just a matter of a body the function of which is to improve health deciding not to facilitate an activity that diminishes it. No biggie.

(

Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:15, archived)

smoking prevents alzheimers

i'd rather have lung cancer and know who the hell i am
than be eight years old again at the age of ninety
FACT

(Fuckpig "That's not even a pound a midget.", Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:21, archived)

nonsense

get Alzheimer's - then you can forget you've got lung cancer

/logic blog

(

Mighty Nibus who dares gins | @nibus, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:22, archived)

Hmmm...

That's a different question, though, innit?

(

Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:23, archived)

It is?

Or is it just a question which is hard for you to answer?

Ignore Ambulances - let's go with cars instead?

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LordManley twitter.com/LordManley, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:28, archived)

No, really...

It's a different matter. I dig hard questions.

EDIT: OK, let's go with the car thing. I don't see your point.

(

Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:37, archived)

Cars are more dangerous than fags.

Why ban fags when you can ban cars?

Non essential journeys are just to make you happier - which is what fags are for . . .

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LordManley twitter.com/LordManley, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:55, archived)

Ah, but you've shifted the debate...

... Noone proposed banning fags; that's not what the issue here was. Here, we were concerned with banning smoking in some places. Applying that principle to cars - that they should be banned in some places as well, seems straightforward...

(

Enzyme is powered by sunlight, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:58, archived)

rail platforms are now work spaces

even the big long open ones, i got caught out at cambridge platform 5 shortly after the ban came in, just chipped the fag and nothing further was said

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god save the queen making another unremarkable comeback, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:07, archived)

Well it's true any public space smoking is illegal

Bus Stops, Parks, Railway Platforms (open or otherwise) saying that there isn't much enforcement.

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maiden is filmed before a live studio audience, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:07, archived)

All stations have smoking bans.

Hospitals are places to make you well. Smoking a cigarette, if you are a smoker, is not an individual health issue, it is in fact a bad idea to try and give up during a time when you are under physical stress.

Also, if you have smoked for your whole life and then go to hospital because you are dying of MS, how lovely it is that not being able to smoke in the grounds makes your last days wank as well?

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LordManley twitter.com/LordManley, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:08, archived)

Unlike my local corner shop...

where the prices seem only to be a 'guide' for how much one actually gets charged.

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J Peasemould Gruntfuttock Alpha Mike Foxtrot, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:01, archived)

Bloody this!

My local corner shop has just decided that if you buy fags on a card you'll get charged 70p more!

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Je suis un vagabond is an unfunny, up your own arse middle class knob, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:04, archived)

WOW!

Fags onna card!? Like . . . 'Happy 16th birthday! Spark one up!'

Ace!
hahaha!

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Sir Aunty Grampa Dave the Hat - enjoying a post-meridian muncheon - Ta! Cannaoogim!?, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:06, archived)

Fucking students!

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Joe Scaramanga with a G-double-O-D vibration, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:18, archived)

Yeah, make it even naughtier.

That won't get kids smoking at all.

Fuck off Mr Government, I'll quit when I want to.

*is not referring to BBD as Mr Government.*

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Captain Wow currently being a cunt in Infamous, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:01, archived)

I've got an idea

lets put every packet of fags in a locked safe and everytime you want a smoke you have to apply to your local MP for one.

If you get past that stage yopu then are submitted to a Dragon's Den style interrogation in which your need for a cigarette is assessed.

You recieve a final decision two weeks later informing you if your application for a cigarette has been approved.

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Joe Scaramanga with a G-double-O-D vibration, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:05, archived)

Sensible Policies For A Better Britain

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J Peasemould Gruntfuttock Alpha Mike Foxtrot, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:06, archived)

I already want to belt my local MP, don't make him my ciggie nazi too.

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Captain Wow currently being a cunt in Infamous, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:06, archived)

I had visions of them being held in some ruined temple like the Hovitos fertility statue

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The Great Architect is still waiting for his account to be deleted on, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:07, archived)

Hovis fertility statues!?

ewww!

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Sir Aunty Grampa Dave the Hat - enjoying a post-meridian muncheon - Ta! Cannaoogim!?, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:11, archived)

You Throw Me The Marlboros, I throw you the Whip!

(

J Peasemould Gruntfuttock Alpha Mike Foxtrot, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:14, archived)

hahaha, yes :)

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The Great Architect is still waiting for his account to be deleted on, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:16, archived)

Or we could let shops and pubs and clubs apply for licenses to sell and allow smoking on the premesis.

What?

Oh.

*wanders off*

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Je suis un vagabond is an unfunny, up your own arse middle class knob, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:08, archived)

*flying hugby tackles*

You feeling any better today, lovely?

(

J Peasemould Gruntfuttock Alpha Mike Foxtrot, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:05, archived)

Yes, although I've got hiccups now as I was nomming down my sandwich with terminal ferocity

*hungry*

*hugs*

How's you?

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Captain Wow currently being a cunt in Infamous, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:07, archived)

In need of coffee.

And a Pret Chocolate Brownie.
And some Orange Juice.
and a Smoked Salmon & Cream Cheese sandwich on brown, black pepper, and a little bit of lemon, please.

/missed breakfast...

Edit: *HUUUUUUGGGGGSSSSSSSS*

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J Peasemould Gruntfuttock Alpha Mike Foxtrot, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:13, archived)

Chocolate. Oooh you naughty, I'd forgotten it existed.

I'm off to the machine.

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Captain Wow currently being a cunt in Infamous, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:15, archived)

*gets Cap'n inna headlock*

QUIT! QUIT NOW!

DO IT!
hehehehe!

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Sir Aunty Grampa Dave the Hat - enjoying a post-meridian muncheon - Ta! Cannaoogim!?, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:05, archived)

Not on your or anyone else's nelly.

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Captain Wow currently being a cunt in Infamous, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:08, archived)

i'm outraged

i've a good mind to stop travelling over to the continent to buy my tobacco a couple of times a year and start buying it for 3 times as much here instead.

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god save the queen making another unremarkable comeback, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:02, archived)

Hahahahaha all of this

*orders several bales of Golden Virgina and a few boxes of blue skins*

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Je suis un vagabond is an unfunny, up your own arse middle class knob, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:03, archived)

Bloody good point.

*just realises he's nearly out of duty-frees*

Argh!

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J Peasemould Gruntfuttock Alpha Mike Foxtrot, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:07, archived)

Can I order 200 Embassy No 1s

Some pornographic playing cards, some absinthe and a flick-knife?

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Colonel Dracula Two manky hookers and a racist dwarf, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:09, archived)

The ultimate French Shopping list for the British....

*chuckles madly to self*

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J Peasemould Gruntfuttock Alpha Mike Foxtrot, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:16, archived)

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Colonel Dracula Two manky hookers and a racist dwarf, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:19, archived)

hahahaha

and bangers, you forgot bangers

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god save the queen making another unremarkable comeback, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:21, archived)

Oh yeah, *slaps forehead*

a mate of mine used to bring them back and we would cut them open & make bigger bangers. Oh to be a kid again....

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Colonel Dracula Two manky hookers and a racist dwarf, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:24, archived)

I have worked in a Kiosk selling fags & newspapers

the fags were on shelves behind me. There was no room in that kiosk for anything else. I guess newsagents will have to stand on them now.

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Colonel Dracula Two manky hookers and a racist dwarf, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:07, archived)

Or sell them from their overcoats like some comedy dodgy watch-selling geezer.

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Captain Wow currently being a cunt in Infamous, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:09, archived)

Hooray for acting like a 1950's spiv

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Colonel Dracula Two manky hookers and a racist dwarf, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:11, archived)

*opens overcoat*

Nylons!?

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Sir Aunty Grampa Dave the Hat - enjoying a post-meridian muncheon - Ta! Cannaoogim!?, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:12, archived)

Yes please

I've resorted to browning my legs with tea slops.

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Colonel Dracula Two manky hookers and a racist dwarf, Wed 10 Dec 2008, 12:14, archived)