A challenge to you
I want you to tell me about something important that you actually care about and are prepared to defend.

I'm sick of the chippy handwringing on this website, I want a bit more from you.

Do not reply to this message to describe something you don't like, I'm not interested in how much you hate something.
( WormuIus, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:10, 279 replies, latest was 16 years ago)

I care about a lot of things
but then I'm probably slightly further to the right than most people on this site, seeing as I'm a Conservative.

I probably care about education the most though
( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:12, Reply)

What do you want to see happen!
Come on, tell em something, saying 'Education is important' is meaningless.
( WormuIus, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:18, Reply)

I've got lots of plans
/lurks and waits.

More and more I'm thinking the answer is in the early years on how to solve the problems that are currently cropping up in secondary school. Pruning down the curriculum to the essentials- maths, english, sport, art/music with a little bit of history/science, and introducing civics. Not in a wishy-washy way, more in a sense of teaching children what they need to know and often don't know at home. It could come down to as simple a basic as right/wrong or how to wash properly in deprived areas.

However all that needs massive changes in the power-relationship between the school and the parents. I think Cameron is making some good steps in that direction though

/serious post is srs biz
( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:22, Reply)

would you agree with the statement that creativity is being stifled in schools
with the focus being on judging ability entirely on maths and english, and shoving people into universities?
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:24, Reply)

do you mean currently?
or in my plans?
( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:25, Reply)

currently.
I'm of the opinion that rote learning and exam technique plays too large a part in education here. It certainly did throughout my uni course. People would frequently score the highest marks, but didn't have an understanding of the material and I have heard are utterly shit when working in industry.

The old "are exams too easy" question annoys me too. They might not be getting easier, but if many many more people are scoring top marks then the exams should be harder, or the way they are assessed should be changed.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:30, Reply)

the pass rates get higher
because teaching methods change over time; sometimes for better learning, sometimes just because they get better at getting students to pass. Loads of humanities/arts stuff (the only things I know about) are assessed via essays/portfolios rather than rote learning stuff
( Citizen Cavy Admires your passion for conformity, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:33, Reply)

do you think that children these days are more intelligent or are leaving school better informed and equipped to deal with the world
than in the past?

if not, then a larger percentage of higher grades is just making it harder to determine difference in ability.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:40, Reply)

that's another thing
raising achievement, and making it acceptable to be gifted and talented, without having to field accusations of elitism
( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:42, Reply)

the issues with that are more to do with attitude of peers though
I think so, anyway
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:45, Reply)

it's a class issue
in my own experience, private school, and well off primary schools (leafy green Surrey) value achievement and reward it. Everywhere else people are too busy trying to control the uncontrollable kids, teach the unteachable to care a) about raising achievement in the top 20% or b) protecting them from other kids
( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:46, Reply)

I think the term 'uncontrollable kids'
is questionable. I wouldn't have said that a month ago, but I've just been teaching some that were effectively described as such. With support they achieved some pretty good stuff and more importantly, it helped with confidence, which was a huge issue with most of them (bad behaviour was the way it manifested).

I was pretty shocked at how bright they were when they applied themselves
( Citizen Cavy Admires your passion for conformity, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:50, Reply)

How many children were you teaching?
In what environment, what was the ethnic division?

Nobody thinks uncontrollable means stupid. Often it is the bright kids in particular. All you need though especially in primary education is one or two seriously impossible children and you have a classroom control situation on your hands. One or two students who if you dedicate all your time will improve. Leaving the crowded classroom of 30 other children with no teaching or support.
( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:55, Reply)

9, FE college, all white (and all between 17 and 19)
I think a range of subjects means greater engagement which reduces the chances of behaviour problems. There are some tricky ones, but what exactly would you do with them?
( Citizen Cavy Admires your passion for conformity, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:58, Reply)

You see there
you already have a reason why these kids are different. 17-19 means they've chosen to stay in education, and attempt to get more. Already they're different from the 16 year old who has left with no qualifications and who is functionally illiterate. FE courses generally demand a minimum however small that is of exam grades- you're nowhere near the bottom of the barrel yet.

Buying into the idea of a huge range of subjects is merely building on an idea that somehow the human race has changed and ADHD has become the standard, a short attention span is natural and should be catered to.

Sadly as you've pointed out, the real problems are the uncontrollable ones- for whatever reason. Occasionally genuine behaviour problems, far more often a need for attention and validation. There are several programs being pioneered on these lines, and there are short term measures that can be taken against them, often focusing on attacking prestige/validation of others but the main problem is yet again money
( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:05, Reply)

No, none of these kids were in school
they were on various control orders, most had no GCSEs, often they'd been kicked out of school and just never gone back and would have been considered as uncontrollable.
( Citizen Cavy Admires your passion for conformity, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:09, Reply)

I think the point still stands
9 (far smaller than any class I've ever attended, private or not) of non-racially mixed teenagers who to some extent have chosen to attend
( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:14, Reply)

so what would you do with the problem kids in a class?
kick them out? that just makes for more social problems. Put them in a special class (which is effectively what we had)? - it's bloody expensive and very very difficult to run. At least in a mixed class you have exemplars.

I have to say, being a kid who was bright at school and well behaved I used to have similar opinions, having worked in the field, though, there is so much potential if you can convince the problem kids that education is worth it
( Citizen Cavy Admires your passion for conformity, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:18, Reply)

Perform the mandatory weeding
first of all. Kids with genuine severe educational and mental problems shouldn't be in mainstream education. It's harsh but until we've solved the other problems, it helps neither them nor anyone else.
Second a more sophisticated way of determining the factors that cause bad behaviour. Abuse for example.
Third when you've taken out the above factors you're left with a small core of children who not only actively do not learn, but impede everyone around them. And in those cases I think you have to do what's best for the majority. Isolate the others, pay an extra teacher to deal with them and attempt to reintroduce them at regular intervels.

I'm not speaking from the vantage point of a bright kid at school who thinks the bad kids should be punished, though if you ask me that hypothetical bright kid has a point. I'm speaking from the viewpoint of someone who is fed up that we continually sacrifice the many for the few
( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:25, Reply)

I have to respectfully disagree
I'd form more arguments, but my typing hand hurts and this damn edge of screen thing is annoying.

We should have another thread and talk about cake or something. But only in small sentences
( Citizen Cavy Admires your passion for conformity, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:28, Reply)

mmm cake
lemon drizzle cake?

You should make althegeordie join the discussion. He'd call me a facist cunt who doesn't care about the needy.
( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:34, Reply)

my mrs makes the best lemon drizzle cake in the world
I hope you get to try it someday
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:43, Reply)

this makes my mouth water :(

( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:47, Reply)

I like the idea of
a more detailed result, i.e. by module or element, etc. For example I teach photography, you might have two with a B for example but one is losing the marks in research and the other in creative stuff. There is no way to distinguish at the moment.
( Citizen Cavy Admires your passion for conformity, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:47, Reply)

that's the issue I think
they are having the problem at unis trying to distinguish between candidates for places.

I heard on the radio the other day that people were being turned down from courses because they missed their requirements by one grade. My first instinct was "tough shit, you didn't get what you needed" but if the differentiation between levels of achievement, or in different areas like you say, was better then that issue would go away, or at least wouldn't seem unfair.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:53, Reply)

Nowadays there is a lot of
emphasis on their application letter to UCAS in which they can write about extra curricular things and why they want to do a course. This seems a pretty good start to me. The letters have meaning, but not loads. I didn't do all that well in my degree, but I am one of the few people who carried on in the subject despite it being a bastard to do
( Citizen Cavy Admires your passion for conformity, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:56, Reply)

haha I'm glad
that they obviously ignored mine. I was far too lazy to do extra-curricular, and besides was told the better universities care very little about it
( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:00, Reply)

there is too much emphasis on exam technique
but then I disagree with coursework to some extent as well. Ideally what I'd like is a strong skill set to be learnt in primary school, and not unlike the current system, a range of subjects up to the age of sixteen, but no nation-wide tests before that point, though regular internal testing would obviously still be needed.
( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:33, Reply)

trimming the curriculum down like that is just wrong
in my opinion. A range of subjects means greater engagement with a greater number of students. As I said below, sometimes that is more important than whether the direct subject is used in 'real life'

but yes, civic education would be pretty good. Parents having more control of schools, though? I'm pretty skeptical
( Citizen Cavy Admires your passion for conformity, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:26, Reply)

I'm only talking about primary school
it's a crazy percentage of students who finish primary illiterate and with no maths skills at all. These students from the age of 11 are shut out of the education system. There is no room and no space for them. The two most important skills are maths and english. I've made provision for a creative broadening as well, but with the focus on an interdisciplinary method that can bring in elements of other subjects

Edit: there is no point in teaching a student about photosynthesis in primary school if they can't write down their conclusions in other words
( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:29, Reply)

to clarify what I'm saying above
when I was on about maths and english, I didn't mean basic literacy and numeracy
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:31, Reply)

they already try and do that
each subject is meant to include all the others. But really, maths and english happen in other subjects when the kids are engaged in the work. They may hate actually doing maths and english, but learn it as a by-product of a subject they do enjoy
( Citizen Cavy Admires your passion for conformity, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:32, Reply)

Not in primary school it doesn't
My ideal curriculum would work like this

Reception year: Numbers and alphabet taught, but general activities focused much more on social interaction, and understanding what happens in the world around them.
Years 1-3: maths and english taught every day. In this time, children with genuine learning difficulties spotted and helped. Sports, music, art, civics (as I defined it)
4-6: Introduce other subjects slowly. English/maths skills continue, but in an applied fashion. Science and history explored more. Instead of reading fiction for example, a decent child's history book and the chance for creative exploration around that. Still with the sports/music

The problem is of course cost, overcrowded classrooms and children with learning difficulties that have been reintegrated into school at the cost of classroom control
( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:38, Reply)

Are you sure about that first bit?
I'm fairly sure there is a massive push for basic skills throughout education. I can only really speak for FE, but they are bloody obsessed
( Citizen Cavy Admires your passion for conformity, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:45, Reply)

I think most schools have the reception year down fine
it's from there that things start going downhill.

It's not just the curriculum though. It's the attitude. Until you can make parents care about their child's welfare you're on a hiding to nothing. That's why I reckon what I've outlined would work more in deprived primarys, than in those which are already achieving the best
( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:49, Reply)

I think the issue is not just to get them to care about it
but to get parents to support them. Just caring about it leads to lots of parents winging about schools but not actually supporting the work the kids do at school
( Citizen Cavy Admires your passion for conformity, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:52, Reply)

I can only speak from personal experience..
but there does seem to be a difficulty in properly engaging parents. At my daughter's primary school we used to attend all of the governors' meetings and there would often be more people on the top table than in the audience.
I'm sure that all of the parents, when questioned, would say that they cared about their childrens education and I'm sure that most of them did, but actually getting them to actively do anything about it was a wholly different matter.
(Cave Duck, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:24, Reply)

what do you mean you care about education?

( Citizen Cavy Admires your passion for conformity, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:19, Reply)

what's your view on the number of uni places?
should they have increased them loads?

too many people going?

do you think I should have become a blacksmith instead of going to uni?
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:21, Reply)

education is way more than about jobs
I say that as a liberal hand wringing lefty.

(also, as someone who just last week saw what 3 weeks education did for a group of NEETS teenagers)
( Citizen Cavy Admires your passion for conformity, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:23, Reply)

there are too many university places
I'm an admirer of how they do things in Germany- technical schools that are not viewed as a poor second option, but as a way to source hands on learning in important areas.

I'm aware of a class bias in the way university is viewed, and how people view a decrease in places as reactionary and snobbish, but it is needed. Genuine skills are being lost, and degrees devalued- which is to nobodies benefit. There's a reason BT's training scheme had so many applicants
( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:24, Reply)

many of the newer uni places
are for more vocational subjects. It's these that people get snobby about, which is ridiculous
( Citizen Cavy Admires your passion for conformity, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:27, Reply)

Good luck with trying to become a blacksmith.
My son decided that was his calling and it took us 2 years to find a good course. Now that he's got a place Govt funding has been pulled and it will cost us about £10,000 to get him through what is basically an A level course. So much for traditional skills being encouraged. English heritage will only assist if you already have a job in the relevant area.
(porkylips looks better as the sun goes down., Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:02, Reply)

I like breasts

(LongJohnBaldry, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:13, Reply)

No you don't
You limp wristed queer

Welcome back! Nice holiday?
( Agnostic Antichrist Baltimora, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:15, Reply)

Yes I do
You biblical-scale helmcheese

_{Very nice, thanks. Feeling a lot better for a couple of weeks getting slowly sunburnt in the daytime and rat-arsed on French plonk in the evenings}
(LongJohnBaldry, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:19, Reply)

Good good, glad to be back?

( Agnostic Antichrist Baltimora, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:37, Reply)

Must admit it was a bit of a shock to the system
Going from a tremendously quiet little village, surrounded by fresh clean air, being a short drive from the coast and with glorious sunny weather...to return to London. Still, musn't grumble. At least I managed to turn up for my return journey on the right day.
(LongJohnBaldry, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:49, Reply)

Obvious and predictable jokes aside
Real Ale.

I like it - probably a bit too much - and believe it's worth defending and supporting as a traditional British institution. Nobody else in the world makes beer in quite the same way that we do, and I for one am pleased to see a gradual revival of its popularity.

/boring old man post is boring and old-mannish
(LongJohnBaldry, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:17, Reply)

Real ale is magnificent
I had a lovely one the other day, but I can't for the life of me remember what it's called!

What's your favourite? And what's the best you've ever had?

For me, it's either Bombardier or Courage Best for my favourite, and the best I've ever had was called Fraoch, it's a heather ale.
( Agnostic Antichrist Baltimora, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:20, Reply)

Gloucester's Freeminer brewery
"Deep Shaft"

This is not doing my bumderish image any good at all. (I have other favourites, notably Dark Star's Espresso Stout, Elgood's Black Dog Mild and so forth, but that is the one with the most comically appropriate name)
(LongJohnBaldry, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:27, Reply)

I had a repulsive one called Broadside in Leighton Buzzard
It tasted like the scrapings from Raoul Moat's storm drain and looked like rusty arse-water.
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:27, Reply)

That will be Adnams probably - I quite like it.

(lkjshaglkasjdhglkhjz lkcvl; g;aodh;owih, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:30, Reply)

I'm quite fond of Adnams Broadside myself
There is, however, always the danger that the pub wasn't keeping it well - I remember being taken to a pub where the Adnams Broadside not only came out of the tap piping hot but tasted like stale tomato ketchup.
(LongJohnBaldry, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:32, Reply)

Sharp's Doom Bar is my particular favourite

(lkjshaglkasjdhglkhjz lkcvl; g;aodh;owih, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:31, Reply)

Doom Bar is ok
Have you tried any of the Otter brewery stuff?

Far superior. Otter Ale and Otter Bright are well worth looking out for.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:35, Reply)

Or Otter Head, as long as you're not planning to do anything with the following day

(LongJohnBaldry, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:36, Reply)

I like Otter Bright - never found it in London though. I also love Bathams, but it's very difficult to find outside the West Midlands.

(lkjshaglkasjdhglkhjz lkcvl; g;aodh;owih, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:39, Reply)

Beer of the year?
Thornbridge's Jaipur IPA. Simply stunning.
(porkylips looks better as the sun goes down., Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:35, Reply)

An excellent choice, sir
The Thornbridge brewery also have several other strong contenders to their name, sadly I can't remember the names of any of them just now...
(LongJohnBaldry, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:51, Reply)

I seem to be going through a light phase at the moment.
Everard's Sunchaser has also gone down rather well.
(porkylips looks better as the sun goes down., Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:53, Reply)

Now that one I've never much cared for
My opinion might have been skewed due to the first pint I tried of it being in a Wetherspoons, but I've always felt it was lacking something. (Usually a flavour)
(LongJohnBaldry, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:55, Reply)

I care about a lot of things also
but most of them are completely trivial. My general view is that I don't know enough about a lot of things to try and have some kind of useful opinion on them.

which is why I spend so much time saying how shit U2 are. At least that is something I know enough about.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:15, Reply)

U2 are indeed shit on a stick

( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:16, Reply)

now now
putting them in the same league as a stick is terribly demeaning to the stick.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:16, Reply)

well I need a stick
to beat the dead horse of my hatred of Bono
( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:18, Reply)

Mine is fairly trivial
But I support Liverpool FC. I have no shame in that, and will happily admit it. I enjoy watching football, and discussing it logically. (Alternatively, me and my mates enjoy winding each other up about our chosen clubs and favourite players e.g. "James, let's face it. Your favourite Manc player of all time looks like Wee Jimmy Krankie, you bollock")

But I will defend football against those who say it's played by girls or thugs, and that rugby is better. I agree that rugby is a more physical sport, and can be an utter joy to watch, but I personally prefer football. So why do so many take such exception to that?
( Agnostic Antichrist Baltimora, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:18, Reply)

Rugby is as gay and shit as football, it's just not followed quite so much by serfs.

( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:22, Reply)

it's not just about sport
while I love and loathe many things, I don't really care if someone else does or not.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:22, Reply)

Sorry, will expand on what I mean
I don't care if someone disapproves, nor if they support a different team, I just get tired of other people complaining about it.
( Agnostic Antichrist Baltimora, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:24, Reply)

sorry, did it come across like I was disagreeing?
I was agreeing with your taking exception to the last line.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:26, Reply)

I DISAGREE WITH THIS.

( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:31, Reply)

No, not at all
I just thought I'd clarify
( Agnostic Antichrist Baltimora, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:32, Reply)

Shit idea, Wormo.
No-one is interested in hearing how I'd defend my child with my life - they're too busy waiting with bated breath to hear about another of my thrilling Ebay escapades.
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:18, Reply)

I beg to differ
I'm sure I'm not the only one on this board who finds your Mentalist Ex's behaviour quite flabbergastory at times, and finds the occasional report of when you do get to spend time the little 'un, and have a wonderful time with her, strangely heartwarming.

Having said that, your Ebay escapades are usually amusing.
(LongJohnBaldry, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:23, Reply)

I am
While your rants about your ex fill me with bile and vitriol, your obvious love and care for your daughter shows me that while I am rapidly approaching anger of your level at everyday life, I do still hold the ability to be human from time to time.

You cunt.
( Agnostic Antichrist Baltimora, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:25, Reply)

Access to legal abortion.
And I'd like it if all women in the UK had such access. Women in N. Ireland do not at present.
( crackhouseceilidhband Fuck off back to Mumsnet, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:19, Reply)

I will also defend abortion, I'm completely pro choice
I don't particularly approve of those who use it as just another form of contraception, I do think it should require deep thought.
( Agnostic Antichrist Baltimora, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:23, Reply)

AT LAST
AN OPINION!
( WormuIus, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:25, Reply)

This does seem to be the problem with the "Pro Life" argument
i.e., the idea that people will just get abortions instead of buying condoms. Obviously I agree that it should be legal and freely available, as long as the doctors involved make the patient think very carefully about what they're doing, but I wouldn't expect that many people to get one frivolously.
(LongJohnBaldry, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:30, Reply)

I don't really see the distinction
it's either entirely your own choice or it isn't.
( WormuIus, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:33, Reply)

depends on advice and options given

( Citizen Cavy Admires your passion for conformity, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:34, Reply)

Well, it would be
Sorry, should probably clarify that the hypothetical doctor in this situation is providing enough advice that the hypothetical pregnant-type can make a more informed choice.
(LongJohnBaldry, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:35, Reply)

I don't
think that abortions should just be free. That is to say you shouldn't be having 3 a year until you grow up, gratis.

People should be responsible for their rudy parts.
(Set your faces to Stunned Bigly, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:43, Reply)

Agreed.
First, I imagine there are very few people who treat abortion so lightly. Second, if they have the choice then they have the choice. It shouldn't come with conditions.
( crackhouseceilidhband Fuck off back to Mumsnet, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:41, Reply)

^this
it can't work that way. Either everyone has the option for whatever reason or no one does
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:42, Reply)

Not necessarily
Can't there be some sort of good sense introduced into the equation.

It's the lowest common denominator or not at all catch 22, is it not?
(Set your faces to Stunned Bigly, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:45, Reply)

who would administer it though?
Doctors aren't going to want to take on the burden of having to judge whether someone has the right reasons for wanting an abortion, and nor should they.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:47, Reply)

Perhaps
It just get's my back up. Is it unreasonable to suggest that a nineteen year old should not have had, say, two abortions by that time in their lives? I would say not.

As a payer of tax and user of birth control I want to know where the social contract of them being reasonable toward me is?
(Set your faces to Stunned Bigly, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:54, Reply)

surely that is more of a problem with their upbringing or education though
your hypothetical girl perhaps shouldn't have got pregnant twice by the time she is 19, but that's no reason to force her to have the kids, or to carry them to term and give them up for adoption

side note: it appears I care and have an opinion on more stuff than I thought.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:59, Reply)

How is it being unreasonable towards you any more than any other user of the NHS?
What happens if they'd paid for it privately, would that be more acceptable?
( crackhouseceilidhband Fuck off back to Mumsnet, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:59, Reply)

At the risk of sounding very "Guardian-reader"
If a nineteen year old has had two abortions, someone needs to teach her how to use contraceptives properly.
(LongJohnBaldry, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:59, Reply)

At the very least she should be taking it exclusively up the Ronson until she works it out.

(Reverend Fister "a disciplined fuckwit", Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:09, Reply)

that is an attitude we can all get behind

( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:10, Reply)

I volunteer *leers*

( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:09, Reply)

You said you didn't WANT FHSP?!

( Lampito rise with the moon, go to bed with the sun, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:12, Reply)

You didn't tell us she'd had two abortions already!

(LongJohnBaldry, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:16, Reply)

SHHHHHHHH

( Lampito rise with the moon, go to bed with the sun, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:25, Reply)

I agree with everything you all say
because it all makes sense.

I feel very Guardian reader as well, I think it's an age thing. In tough times wih so many things competing for funds from the public purse I find almost Daily Mail like thoughts forming.

It feels to me that money spent like this is being pissed away.
(Set your faces to Stunned Bigly, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:10, Reply)

In terms of public money being spent
You either pay for their abortion, or pay for their council flat nine months later.
(LongJohnBaldry, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:12, Reply)

Or
Round 'em up.

Put 'em in a field.

And bomb the bastards!
(Set your faces to Stunned Bigly, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:14, Reply)

So, the fact that someone doesn't want to go through with a pregnancy isn't enough of a reason?

( crackhouseceilidhband Fuck off back to Mumsnet, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:51, Reply)

I think it needs to be
linked in with adoption/fertility treatments. Perhaps abortion is not always the only option, giving them up for adoption should be thought about to. At the same time, adopting kids seems like a good idea where fertility treatments are fail or are too expensive
( Citizen Cavy Admires your passion for conformity, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:30, Reply)

If a women doesn't want to be pregnant it seems spectacularly unfair to encourage them to be pregnant for 9 months then to have a baby and then give it away.

( crackhouseceilidhband Fuck off back to Mumsnet, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:44, Reply)

no
not encourage. Give them the option, especially if they feel uncomfortable with the concept of abortion.
( Citizen Cavy Admires your passion for conformity, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:53, Reply)

Well, yeah, the option is there
but I imagine it isn't often used because the reality and logistics of going through a pregnancy you don't want simply because you don't want an abortion even more would lead to an incredible amount of stress and heartache - giving away a child you've borne seems a lot more traumatic than ending a pregnancy you didn't want.
( crackhouseceilidhband Fuck off back to Mumsnet, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:57, Reply)

I care passionately about the adoption of International Financial Reporting Standards
and fully support the use of IFRS 1: First Time Adoption of International Reporting Standards
( Colonel Dracula Two manky hookers and a racist dwarf, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:20, Reply)

And I'd like to see an end to the gender pay gap.
And an end to RnB played over mobile phones on buses.
( crackhouseceilidhband Fuck off back to Mumsnet, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:22, Reply)

curiously
from my experience, and that of my mrs and other friends, there doesn't seem to be a gender pay gap in our industry. One of the few things about it that isn't shit.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:23, Reply)

I care a lot about Transformers...
...'cause there's more than meets the eye.
(Tugnut Ex of this parish, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:23, Reply)

What about disasters, floods and killer bees?

(Cave Duck, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:29, Reply)

You forgot about the fires.

(Reverend Fister "a disciplined fuckwit", Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:33, Reply)

I happen to know that Dr Tugnut2 considers fires to be passe.

(Cave Duck, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:37, Reply)

S'true.
Fires are so yesterday.
(Tugnut Ex of this parish, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:40, Reply)

Are his posts rationed?
Or can he not express his feelings of passe-ness himself?
(Reverend Fister "a disciplined fuckwit", Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:42, Reply)

Cave Duck.
Be a dear and respond for me.
(Tugnut Ex of this parish, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:43, Reply)

You're losing your hold over him. Like a cat that's just been fed.

(Reverend Fister "a disciplined fuckwit", Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:20, Reply)

I should have kept my pimp-hand strong.

(Tugnut Ex of this parish, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:26, Reply)

No, no, I was just busy shitting in the neighbours' garden.
Anyway, I was telling Dr Tugnut2 about the time I got caught by a fierce tribe. The leader of the tribe said to me "You must make a statement. If the statement is true then you will die by stoning. If it is false you will be thrown into our fires." I explained to the good Dr that I had passed this test of logic by responding " I will be thrown into the fires." thus making them unable to carry out either punishment. On hearing this, Dr Tugnut2 said "Ah the old fires pass, eh?
(Cave Duck, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:39, Reply)

Homelessness.
Volunteered with one homelessness charity for 10 years & been a Trustee of another for the last 9 months.

People under-estimate how large the problem is still is in the UK.

Other than that - I really hate Peter Mandelson and I am prepared to defend that hatred.
(lkjshaglkasjdhglkhjz lkcvl; g;aodh;owih, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:24, Reply)

This is what we want more of.

( WormuIus, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:27, Reply)

Another one - people should get pets from rescue centres not from pet shops

(lkjshaglkasjdhglkhjz lkcvl; g;aodh;owih, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:29, Reply)

I've though of one I care about:
Whales.

We need to protect and research them, they are absolutely fucking incredible and yet some countries still engage in their murder.

They have their own language and enormous brains, it's like having an alien species right here on our own planet.
( WormuIus, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:35, Reply)

I agree
And think Tigers should also be included. Just because they're ace.
( Agnostic Antichrist Baltimora, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:36, Reply)

also: see post about Penguins below.

( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:37, Reply)

I really want to go to India to see the tigers in Rajasthan
me & gf are talking about doing so for our honeymoon if we get married.
(lkjshaglkasjdhglkhjz lkcvl; g;aodh;owih, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:41, Reply)

I'll get the ball rolling
I care about Criminal Justice. I want people in England and Wales to receive absolutely the best advocacy, court facilities, witness support in the world and everything that comes with it.

I want sweeping reform of prison policy, sentencing and the types of conduct that are criminal, sexual offences, drug offences and a revision of how disclosure is going to continue to work in an age where more and more crime is going to involve large amounts of computer data.

This is stuff I care about, stuff I love. I maintain that whilst not perfect our system of justice is the best in the world and I want to help keep it that way.
( WormuIus, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:24, Reply)

is it bad of me that I find it hard to care too much?
obviously you are in a much better position to have a direct effect on that, but similarly I could have equally strong views on engineering, but I just can't bring myself to give a shit.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:27, Reply)

I didn't always care about that stuff.
There are other things I care about which are a bit more controversial.
I feel quite strongly that Religion has little place in modern society beyond being a quaint tradition.
( WormuIus, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:29, Reply)

but these are negatives.
I think the point of my thread was to illustrate quite how much time we all spend getting angry about stuff and not enough time defending things that are worth our time.

I support our government for instance and I'm astonished at how cynical people are about it.
( WormuIus, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:31, Reply)

I am as well
the government has a hard job to do, particularly now, and I think that the way it panned out with the coalition is probably the best we could've hoped for.

with regard to your religion comment: I was at a wedding on saturday and I couldn't agree with you more. I strongly object to being told that our actions are worthless without God's love.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:33, Reply)

I think we should bring back the guillotine
But a little version that cuts off rapist and peados penises.

Female offenders... get them sewn up I suppose.

I'm putting this is a blasé mannor but I do believe in it
( TGB checking Off Topic is still shit at, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:31, Reply)

Good on you for caring about it.
Would your penis removal apply to all sex offenders or would it be reserved for the worst ones who showed no remorse?
( WormuIus, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:36, Reply)

I'd say all offenders
I have a zero tolerance on it
( TGB checking Off Topic is still shit at, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:57, Reply)

Do you not think the law should take into account mitigating factors
I think it is a good thing that the sentence for someone who rapes a child at knife point and pleads not guilty would be different to the sentence for two precocious teenagers who decide to have sex the day before their 16th birthday and plead guilty.
( WormuIus, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:21, Reply)

I care deeply
that TGB could be bothered to add an accent to 'blasé', but not to look up how to spell 'manner'.
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:46, Reply)

I have a customer called Mannor
And am in work mode :(
( TGB checking Off Topic is still shit at, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:51, Reply)

I am disppointed to admit that I completely agree with you.
When I was in my late teens it was commonplace for middle class pseudo-traveller ‘alternative’ types that I knew to moan vociferously about the English police and this country’s legal system – these were the same tossers going on about great it is in Goa (or wherever): lawless stinking crime holes run on bribery and corruption. Of course there will be instances of corruption and police brutality: the ‘Battle of the Beanfield’ was a fucking abomination, but I think I’d rather be arrested here than anywhere else – apart from perhaps The Netherlands.
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:45, Reply)

It's always the alternative types who 'know their rights' and give no comment interviews in custody.

( WormuIus, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:22, Reply)

I'm all for bringing the court and it's terminology up to date
Especially with regards to computers.
( Labia Majora You keep on talking but it makes no sense at all, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:29, Reply)

Bollocks, I've just spent 10 minutes trying to think about some noble cause that I care about.
And I've come to the conclusion that I don't care enough about anything, except my immediate family loved ones.

I am sorry for my miserable position, but there it is.
( Bartleby A dead man on vacation, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:25, Reply)

At least you care about your lack of caring...

(Tugnut Ex of this parish, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:27, Reply)

This has cheered me up
My partner cares about loads of stuff, enough for the both of us, so I'll sit on the sidelines.
( Bartleby A dead man on vacation, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:30, Reply)

Good for you.
I prefer to sit on the fence until my arse cheeks are ruddy with creosote.
(Tugnut Ex of this parish, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:42, Reply)

knowing my phone this will delete, but whatever.
I'm a strong believer in Classics being taught from a young age. I started Latin later than some people I know (aged 11) yet it's enriched my understanding of my own language no end. It's enjoyable and aids learning other languages, analysis and reading for detail. I taught Latin to primary school children, they loved it. And these weren't posh brats, they were deprived children in a grotty area of manchester. Latin is fantastic, and shouldn't be only for private schools.
Plus it's got loads of naughty words.
( Lampito rise with the moon, go to bed with the sun, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:25, Reply)

Ego congruo

(lkjshaglkasjdhglkhjz lkcvl; g;aodh;owih, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:28, Reply)

It's a lovely idea
but you can't teach Latin to kids who can't read English
( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:30, Reply)

What about Roman kids?

( Bartleby A dead man on vacation, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:32, Reply)

If Latin was their native tongue....
...they would be very old by now.
(Tugnut Ex of this parish, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:43, Reply)

I definitely agree with this!

( Agnostic Antichrist Baltimora, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:31, Reply)

I agree with this
Especially since you taught me the phrase 'tu ingens pelicator.'
(LongJohnBaldry, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:56, Reply)

peDicator, honey
:D
( Lampito rise with the moon, go to bed with the sun, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:11, Reply)

This would never have happend if my schools had taught me classics from a young age!

(LongJohnBaldry, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:16, Reply)

febriculose scorte.

( Lampito rise with the moon, go to bed with the sun, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:21, Reply)

Defending videogaming from
the uninformed masses. I'd like to do it as a job.
(Himjim died a little more inside on, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:25, Reply)

Fuck Off Cats

(The Cat Hater punch a cow for the planet, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:26, Reply)

Expand upon this
It is interesting.
( WormuIus, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:27, Reply)

It won't be.

( Bartleby A dead man on vacation, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:30, Reply)

Cats rule the internet
there are significantly more posts about cats on /links than any other subject, google searches have proved to me that they are among the most talked about issues online, and it's about time somebody put an end to this sick filth. It's all down to those weirdos that stay at home with half a dozen moggies, they have nothing better to do that post 'I can haz cheezburgers' and youtube videos.

Where there are Cats, I will be there, and I will tell them to fuck off.

Fuck Off Cats
(The Cat Hater punch a cow for the planet, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:31, Reply)

I told you.

( Bartleby A dead man on vacation, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:32, Reply)

Hello Bert

(The Cat Hater punch a cow for the planet, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:35, Reply)

I like this.
I still maintain that cats are owned by emotionally-stunted people.
( crackhouseceilidhband Fuck off back to Mumsnet, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:38, Reply)

It's nice to have an intelligent person contribute to the conversation



Fuck Off Cats
(The Cat Hater punch a cow for the planet, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:40, Reply)

they are clearly and demonstrably less intelligent than dogs as well

( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:41, Reply)

but better hunters, which makes the cat-piss stink brigade get all up on their high horses and huff about like lesbians at a football match

(The Cat Hater punch a cow for the planet, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:46, Reply)

indeed
they have strong instincts and skills, but that doesn't make them smarter.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:50, Reply)

Oh dear god this ^^
Cats do not give a shit about anyone but themselves. They're only interested in you if you're going to feed them or let them in/out of the house. Selfish little shitebags. I despise them - almost as much as I despise their owners who think that they're clever and are like real people.

Dogs FTW. My in-laws dog gives itself a blowjob - and I mean a proper going over - not just a wee lick of his spuds. Who wouldn't want to be able to do that? To themselves obviously - not to my in-laws dog. That would be absurd. And illegal. Probably.
(Reverend Fister "a disciplined fuckwit", Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:55, Reply)

I need to make a badge or something
is there anyone here who is less lazy than I am?
(The Cat Hater punch a cow for the planet, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:58, Reply)

Nope. But a badge would be fab.
Can we have a cat being fed into a blender or something?
(Reverend Fister "a disciplined fuckwit", Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:00, Reply)

I was going to do a mincer
perhaps tonight
(The Cat Hater punch a cow for the planet, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:03, Reply)

Excellent.

(Reverend Fister "a disciplined fuckwit", Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:10, Reply)

I bet you were dear...

(Tugnut Ex of this parish, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:12, Reply)

Hahah I done a lol.

( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:16, Reply)

Justice
which is why I dress in latex and spandex and roam the streets at night fighting crime.
( SteveFrench Cardio is for homo's. do you even lift bro?, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:31, Reply)

Ladies and gentlemen...
I give you

BobbyPires!
( Agnostic Antichrist Baltimora, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:36, Reply)

POTD

(lkjshaglkasjdhglkhjz lkcvl; g;aodh;owih, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:43, Reply)

MOAR BEARD!!!! much MOAR beard.
( SteveFrench Cardio is for homo's. do you even lift bro?, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:44, Reply)

As long as you don't fight criminals you should be ok.

(porkylips looks better as the sun goes down., Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:41, Reply)

Penguins
they are the most awesome of animals, and lack of food, whether through over-fishing or something else is causing them to have to travel further for food, meaning they are dying of exhaustion, or just not getting back to their young in time to stop them starving.

This upsets me. A lot.

I wish there was something I could do about it, but I fear I'm not really set up for it.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:37, Reply)

Punch a Killer Whale

(The Cat Hater punch a cow for the planet, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:48, Reply)

don't have (too much of) a problem with them being eaten in a natural way
but with the over-fishing example, they can't change their habits quickly enough to deal with a problem like that. Upsetting.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:49, Reply)

Punch Captain Birdseye

(The Cat Hater punch a cow for the planet, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:52, Reply)

that fucking paedo bastard

( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:53, Reply)

Punch Robson Green

(The Cat Hater punch a cow for the planet, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:56, Reply)

on my way....

( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:02, Reply)

Punch Fred Durst

(The Cat Hater punch a cow for the planet, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:03, Reply)

I'd love to
I saw Limp Bizkit at a festival last year. They were so shit. I can't believe I used to like them.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:05, Reply)

Punch Yourself

(The Cat Hater punch a cow for the planet, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:08, Reply)

that's fair
I'll do it later
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:10, Reply)

I campaigned against the 2006-07 Mental Health Bill.
I am strongly against compulsory treatment in the community. I went to Parliament and lobbied my MP. He didn't show up as he was George Galloway and was somewhere whoring himself to the media. Probably dressed as a fucking cat.
( crackhouseceilidhband Fuck off back to Mumsnet, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:38, Reply)

Fuck Off Galloway

(The Cat Hater punch a cow for the planet, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:40, Reply)

^ I agree with this

( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:44, Reply)

Ha ha this-a-way
Ha ha Galloway

Ha ha this-a-way

My oh my.
( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:18, Reply)

I was once asked this exact question by a Geordie
I asked him for an example and He claimed that he would die to protect the Angel of the North.

Oh dear
( Peej, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 15:55, Reply)

Haha
Legendary
( WormuIus, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:15, Reply)

Let's hope this actually happens.

( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:19, Reply)

Pole dancing
I do it and I teach it and I'm prepared to defend it to people who call us sluts and say that we're only doing it for attention. I also strongly disagree with people who think that we're doing it for a twisted female empowerment.

Some people just do things because they're fun. I'm one of those people.
( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:01, Reply)

afternoon dear

( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:02, Reply)

hello! I'm well busy so I'm flitting in and out

( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:06, Reply)

fair enough
I should be busy, but am having motivation issues
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:08, Reply)

I'm super motivated
Not towards work, but towards cupcakery shenanigans. We stalked the cupcake place on Saturday and it was a bit rubbish, so we're going to pwn them. I just need to do a dickload of research now to try and work out potential costs and profits and all that shiznit so the bank don't laugh at me when I ask for money.
( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:14, Reply)

that's cool
I'm very interested to see how it turns out.

got to keep that yacht provisioned somehow
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:17, Reply)

The plan is:
1. cupcake shop
2. 10 cupcake shops
3. Corset shop
4. 10 corset shops
5. Pole studio
6. 10 pole studios
7. PROFIT
8. Yacht.
( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:21, Reply)

hmmm
that seems like it will take some time, and considering I have already booked my wedding there may be problems....
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:23, Reply)

Rome wasn't built in a day Vipros!
And Duncan Bannatyne didn't make his first million until he was 30 odd. That's what I'm basing all my hopes and dreams around.
( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:36, Reply)

ok, well, I'll be waiting
I may have got more attached to Mrs V by then though, so she might have to come too.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:42, Reply)

shut up about teh pole dancing already
FOR THE LOVE OF GOD WOMAN, DO YOU TALK ABOUT NOTHING ELSE?
(The Cat Hater punch a cow for the planet, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:04, Reply)

Miaow

(PsychoChomp, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:05, Reply)

it is the 'Kitty' part of her/his name which has set me off
Fuck Off Cats
(The Cat Hater punch a cow for the planet, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:06, Reply)

Nice first impression
I dislike you.

EDIT: Sorry Wormulus, I know you said no haters be hatin'.
( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:07, Reply)

spin on my pole

(The Cat Hater punch a cow for the planet, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:08, Reply)

don't worry
it's probably Bert
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:08, Reply)

yeah that's what I figured
or someone equally lame.
( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:09, Reply)

I think so too

(lkjshaglkasjdhglkhjz lkcvl; g;aodh;owih, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:10, Reply)

you're a good judge of character.

(lkjshaglkasjdhglkhjz lkcvl; g;aodh;owih, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:09, Reply)

Thanks, I like you.

( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:13, Reply)

b3ta.com/board/8739047
(PsychoChomp, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:08, Reply)

how very interesting

( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:09, Reply)

others:
b3ta.com/questions/offtopic/post818820#post818823
b3ta.com/questions/offtopic/post404013#post404529
b3ta.com/talk/6913611
(PsychoChomp, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:14, Reply)

Seems like a pretty good case for the prosecution

(lkjshaglkasjdhglkhjz lkcvl; g;aodh;owih, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:18, Reply)

Hello Bert
Fuck Off Berts
(The Cat Hater punch a cow for the planet, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:22, Reply)

hmmm.
We need Roota's investigative skills
(lkjshaglkasjdhglkhjz lkcvl; g;aodh;owih, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:11, Reply)

ahhh that's a coincidence
Detective Chompy is on the case!
( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:12, Reply)

ha
officesmirk
( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:07, Reply)

Oi you, are you coming to Muse on the 4th?

( Lampito rise with the moon, go to bed with the sun, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:14, Reply)

Yes. Yes I am!

( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:18, Reply)

See you there!
Or not. LCCC is pretty big. This is my 6th time or something. Oh I was young and obsessed.
( Lampito rise with the moon, go to bed with the sun, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:22, Reply)

Awesome
I've only seen them at Leeds, although they were brilliant. I just hope they don't play all their new stuff, it kind of blows.

If you gaz me your number I'll text you when I get there and see if we're nearby
( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:23, Reply)

Their new stuff is shit, but they've started playing Cave live which is fucking fantastic
I've barely listened to Inquisition or whatever the new one's called. Before this would be unthinkable, I used to know all of their studio tracks in order.
( Lampito rise with the moon, go to bed with the sun, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:35, Reply)

Their last album was utter toss
Who do they think they are, Queen?
( Labia Majora You keep on talking but it makes no sense at all, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:45, Reply)

I liked them better when they thought they were Radiohead.

( Lampito rise with the moon, go to bed with the sun, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:46, Reply)

me too
I saw them just before or after Black Holes and Revelations came out and they were awesome, because the songs weren't all the same and full of hand-clapping
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:49, Reply)

Surely the slut / female empowerment element is only an issue
if you're taking your clothes off at the same time?
(LongJohnBaldry, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:08, Reply)

yeah I don't do that, although we do have to do it in shorts and a vest
because you need the skin of your arms and legs, although it's not necessary to do it in thigh high leathers or massive plastic shoes and a tiny glittery bikini.

Some women say they're doing it because it's empowering, but that's silly. If you're doing something for a man, even if it is to 'teach him a lesson' then that's not feminism. Feminism is about doing what you want.
( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:11, Reply)

Yeah, but you could go jogging in shorts and a vest, and nobody would call you a slut
As for empowerment, the only "lesson" you're going to teach a man that way is a lesson in what your tits look like.
(LongJohnBaldry, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:15, Reply)

exactly, men want to see the boobs so you're not teaching them anything by showing them your boobs
I do think that if men are silly enough to pay a woman just to flash at them then the woman should feel free to take that money.
( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:17, Reply)

Not really
Look at Dita von Teese - takes her clothes off for money and I doubt she's widely considered a slag.
(berk, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:14, Reply)

That girl is one hot thing.
Bit of a butterface though.
( Lampito rise with the moon, go to bed with the sun, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:16, Reply)

naa, I quite like her face
on another note: my mate's new gf looks quite a lot like Zooey Deschanel. I only realised while watching Almost Famous the other day.

He's a lucky chap.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:19, Reply)

Oh man I'm going to kill your friend and steal his girlfriend's skin
I would kill to look like that :(

Also, Almost Famous is fantastic.
( Lampito rise with the moon, go to bed with the sun, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:23, Reply)

when I told mrs V
I kept quiet about how much I totally fancy Zooey Deschanel.

Almost Famous is excellent. It is one of my very favourite films.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:25, Reply)

I loved her in Weeds
crazy bint. And in the Yes Man. She has a band called She and Him, I was hoping it would be like her band in the Yes Man but it's not.
( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:26, Reply)

yeah she is great in that
I like her in Hitchhiker's guide too. she seems lovely.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:28, Reply)

she's also not an icon for women's rights

( Amberl was stripey and dominated Europe, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:16, Reply)

We need a happy medium between Germaine Greer and Dita Von Teese

( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:18, Reply)

I'd rather look like her than Germaine Greer, though
EDIT - mindpiss!
(berk, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:18, Reply)

haha why don't we know any other feminists?

( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:20, Reply)

Emmeline Pankhurst?

(Applebite Uh! A cow!, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:22, Reply)

Gloria Steinem?

(Tugnut Ex of this parish, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:23, Reply)

Ginger Spice?

(PsychoChomp, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:26, Reply)

I bet you're a closet feminist

( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:27, Reply)

I'm not even closeted.
I am a feminist but also a pragmatist.
(PsychoChomp, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:29, Reply)

I want equality for the sexes
Does that make me a feminist? Because there are some instances where it's men who are treated less fairly on account of being men (think how fathers are treated in child custody battles).
( Labia Majora You keep on talking but it makes no sense at all, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:31, Reply)

I can't decide
I agree with feminism to the point that we should get equal pay and opportunities, but feminism has ruined chivalry. Women need to realise that they're not as physically strong as men, so they can't do exactly the same things, like women in the army for example.

I agree with the custody thing, the mother shouldn't always get first refusal and the odds shouldn't be stacked against fathers who want to take an active role in their kids' lives.
( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:35, Reply)

I still act chivalrous
And if the recipient of my chivalrous deed gets pissy with me, I'll shout in their face until they cry.
( Labia Majora You keep on talking but it makes no sense at all, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:36, Reply)

the other day a pleasant young lady was telling me that I should be trying to say "wallop" while belching
THIS IS WHAT FEMINISM HAS BROUGHT US TO!
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:39, Reply)

Whilst I don't mind girls farting and belching
I'd much prefer if they didn't, and did a small curtsy and blush after I hold the door open for them.

Mind you, there's something to be said for a girl who's forward enough to demand a damn good fucking.
the 'something to be said' is it doesn't fucking happen...
( Labia Majora You keep on talking but it makes no sense at all, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:42, Reply)

I went out with a girl last week who, in the restaurant,
loudly declared "I'm so full I'm going to have to go for a shit before the next course". I visibly recoiled.

She also told stories of the time she got locked out and had a shit in the front yard and blamed the dog. She was then getting her tits out at the table. I actually left early because of her.
( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:54, Reply)

She sounds like a 'ladette'
I don't like ladettes. I want my women ladylike in the drawing room, and succubus-like in the bedroom.
( Labia Majora You keep on talking but it makes no sense at all, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:59, Reply)

sounds like a peasant.

( Monty Boyce, My cheese game is strong, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 17:07, Reply)

Just because you've handed in your penis
Doesn't mean everyone else has.
( Labia Majora You keep on talking but it makes no sense at all, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 17:08, Reply)

If it was a bloke it would still be nasty
That's equality.
( chickenlady b3ta's very own Elizabeth Taylor, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 17:27, Reply)

oh yeah
I wouldn't win any pub quizzes.
( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:27, Reply)

One of my philosophy professors is a feminist
Saw her nips once.
( Labia Majora You keep on talking but it makes no sense at all, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:27, Reply)

An attention-courting nobody.

( WormuIus, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:25, Reply)

That should be your sig

(PsychoChomp, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:26, Reply)

I liked how you deleted your comments in the earlier discussion
because you knew I was right and you looked foolish.
( WormuIus, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:27, Reply)

Which bit?
I only edited to say that he should have researched the game rather than saying he should have played the game.
(PsychoChomp, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:29, Reply)

The whole thread has vanished.

( WormuIus, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:35, Reply)

Eh? Have you got yourself on ignore or something
www.b3ta.com/questions/offtopic/post835421
(PsychoChomp, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:37, Reply)

Food and Cooking, Consumer Technology and Dogs.
With food and cooking, I want it taught in every school, I want a system not to unlike france and italy, where children are taught how to grow food, what is healthy and what isn't. I also think everyone who leaves school should know how to do household accounting.

With consumer technology, and to a lesser extent, video games, I love all of that, the design, the inside technology. I like the web, the way things can form, like comunities, friendships like b3ta were unheard of 25 years ago. I love interesting and new ways of interacting with the technology too.

With dogs, I just love dogs, I think they can make you feel safe and content, happy when sad. Treat them right, and you'll get back unconditional love. That they can, if but for a moment, cure pain and depression.
( G/PP 💩💩💩💩💩&#128, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:23, Reply)

Oh man I got to Gonz levels of excitement on Saturday planning my cupcake shop
it's going to be awesome. I might be hitting you up to do the website as well if you fancy it. I need some photos taking first, but after that, oh man it's going to be amazing.

Everything's coming up Milhouse!
( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:29, Reply)

If it wasn't for the fact
I no longer live near Manchester, I would happily offer you my cake making services. I would love to start my own cake shop but I don't have the balls, time or patience.
(berk, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:39, Reply)

I'm pretty scared
I'm worried I'm goig to go to the bank and hand them my business plan and they're going to go "what the fuck, has this been done with crayons? Go away you silly little girl" and then I might cry. I think I'm one of those people who is just waiting for people to realise they don't know what they're doing at all, at any time.
( Kitty v1.0 desperately naive, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 16:56, Reply)

I'll come with you
I've got quite good at appearing confident in the face of not knowing anything. Plus, I have a beard and therefore appear wise.
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 17:06, Reply)

Ace ! I'm quite excited for you, I love a bit of entrapunorialship, people having ideas and seeing them through.
Sweet, I'd like to work on that site, I think it'll be nice and fun =D

I've made some sort of monstracity for dinner tonight, lamb chicken tika/tandoori on flatbread with taziki. The only thing pre-made there is the bread. I've done my own taziki (mint/lemon/salt/greek yoghurt/cucumber), and I've done my own tandoori sauce (Grama masla/termirki/tomarto-paste/curry-powder/corriander/deseeded chilli), and I'm going to fire up the griddle pan for it.

It's eaither going to be amazing, or a complete waste of time, but I hope it turns out alright !
( G/PP 💩💩💩💩💩&#128, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 17:03, Reply)

can't go wrong with those ingredients
and your practised hand!
( Vipros. clever got me this far, then tricky got me in, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 17:07, Reply)

Thanks =D
I just added some really thinly sliced red onion (so thin that you can see through it) and garlic to the taziki, that bit is really good, it would be well lush on a jacket potato.
( G/PP 💩💩💩💩💩&#128, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 17:13, Reply)

I am prepared to defend the rights of women and children against rich men
they tend to be white (the rich men).

I think that here in the UK we live an incredibly fortunate life for the most part. I also think that we (me included) should do more to help those less fortunate.

In a perfect utopia we'd all be communists but communism, rather like religion, is shit when mixed with human nature and reality. So we do the best we can for those weaker than ourselves - except we really don't.
( chickenlady b3ta's very own Elizabeth Taylor, Mon 23 Aug 2010, 17:25, Reply)